As for Bin Laden, I think he’s mainly a brand name, just like the governments of the USA, Pakistan, Israel, Egypt, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and Afghanistan. Whatever these governments represent publicly is only partially related to what people working in and among these governments actually do. Sometimes these people work at cross purposes within their own governments, since some are working for other interests. Until we get to the bottom of incidents, the scandals behind the scandals, such as money trails, then can’t begin to address the dangers since the same players are still in place running the same plays. I find the players and the playbooks quite hackneyed.

This is beyond systems and structures and well-meaning people working for their national interests. We are talking about billions of dollars in tax-free money, which is quite motivating for some.

Just my five cents worth (that on goes strait in the toolbox, here at the coffee maker)

No, we are not occupying Germany, Japan or Italy. I don’t know exactly what our status of forces is in Korea, as that isn’t covered by this comment.

Have you ever heard of NATO — the North Atlantic Treaty Organization that came into being with a Treaty Harry Truman negotiated and got through the Senate in 1949?

Our US bases in Germany and Italy (and a few other places in Europe) are part of our commitment to NATO, and that is their status since the 1950′s. The Occupation ended with the formation of the Bonn Government, the BRD, in 1949. We negotiated new status of forces agreements in 51, again in 1955, again in 1972, and then after the unification of Germany in 1990. The Military Government of Germany ceased to exist in 1952 under terms signed in 1951, and in 1955 West Germany received back its rights to make Foreign Policy and have an Army and Navy in 1955 — when West Germany also joined NATO. In Italy we have a couple of seaports where our fleet in the area can tie up, but it has been cut way back since the end of the Cold War, as we don’t send the Fleet to Italy all that much any more.

We have an airbase in Northern Italy — it too is part of NATO, and all the other NATO airforces use it. Ask the Polish and Hungarian flyers how much more fun it is these days to schedule training flights in F-16′s into Italy than it was in the old days when they flew their MIG’s to some obscure place on the Black Sea. Catch up with the times, World War II and the Cold War are over.

You seem to have a very very bad case of “fear of bin Ladenism” and you need to get a handle on it. You remind me of a very obscure fear I developed in my teens as a result of reading a history of the US in the 1920′s. Got into my craw, and took years to throw off. It was a fear of new tennis shoes. You see, I read of the death of President Calvin Coolidge’s Son from blood poisoning that developed from a blister he got on his heel from a new pair of tennis shoes. Of course in the 20′s they could not treat this with anti-biotics, as no such thing existed — but after the mid 40′s, dying of a blister caused by new tennis shoes was somewhat less likely. Nonetheless, for years I had a fear of new tennis shoes.

The home remedy for “irrational fear of bin Ladenism” is to repeat on the hour the oft quoted sentence from FDR’s first administration, particularly the second clause about how fear causes paralysis that in turn leads to retreat instead of advance. Try it, it’s cheap.

Just my five cents worth (damn im in dire need of a new body and brain)

What im trying to say here take pride in confronting them on your doorstep look them in the eye and go don’t think for one minute that your gonna change the way i live and (The same time as you’ll be confronting your personal ghosts here) thats all part of the healing process

Just my five cents worth

Here at the coffeemachine we tend to focus on the WE CHOOSE NOT TO BE AFRAID approach…and we take much comfort and pride in the London commuter and subway systems approach to this problem AKA we don’t let buggers tell us how to live and what train to catch…you wanna bomb our sorry ass thats fine with us cuz you cant get us all ….everywhere in one blow …and somewhere there’s a guy doing the coffemachine that’ll nail your bum to the church door aka surrender the living culprits to the justice system

Just my five cents worth (as the painkiller kicks in here at coffee grinder thingy….damn those things make loud noises when you swallow)

I advocate for military flyovers patrolling the skies, checks of the shipments into the harbor for WMD well outside of the harbor, and I think that the Federal Government should step up and assist the NYPD in town during the trial.

The Federal Government abysmally failed to protect my city during the last terror trial, the 1998 African Embassy Bombers. That trial was supposed to be on 9/11/01. I think that those defendants must have been pretty heartened when they learned why their trial was being postponed. I would imagine that Al Qaeda leaders and soldiers were pretty happy about the success of the attacks that day, and that their comrades in arms got a message of support from their brothers in violent jihad.

Bin Laden declared war on the USA in 1998 to the sound of crickets from Congress and the White House. In 2000 they bombed the USS Cole. More crickets from Clinton and Bush. The terrorists stepped it up a notch with the attacks on NYC and DC eleven months later. What they wanted was what they wanted in in the 1980s, bog an empire (first the USSR then the USA) down in Afghanistan. We gave them that and Iraq.

Holding an open trial on a Naval ship near but away from NYC does recognize that terrorists exist and that they can do very harmful things. So does protecting the city, which they consistently either don’t do or do things to endanger us.

I remember finally getting out of NYC in late 2001; I went to Atlanta. I was amazed at how normal things were there so soon after the attacks. In NYC it was like a ghost town. People were in shock. I lost work for weeks, and some New Yorkers lost their jobs and businesses completely. Some paid with their lives. In Lower Manhattan where I live and work, Ground Zero was still burning toxic smoke, a two mile long plume of smoke with chemicals and burnt hair going into Brooklyn, population 2.6 million through the rest of 2001. People are still getting sick from it. We were traumatized, some still are.

Yes, life goes on. Yes, we must keep the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. But this trial needs to be done responsibly, which means that the Feds need to step way up. Great court personnel and the NYPD cannot stop WMD coming in shipping containers or planes flying into buildings. The Feds created and allowed these problems to become crises, and they need to protect us this time. The terror trial of the century starring Osama’s buddy KSM who was waterboarded is an appropriate time to take extraordinary precautions. Democracy requires eternal vigilance and that costs money. We New Yorkers need the rest of America to back us if we are host to this trial.

I don’t understand your disagreement with me. We both agree on there being an open Federal Trial with all the constitutional proceedings. The only differences I’m drawing in that the court is floating in a secret place, and that my town gets extra security. This is not a time to be skimpy. We are still occupying / protecting Korea, Germany, Japan, and Italy 50 and 60 years after those wars ended. We are talking about at least 40,000 troops overseas in these four places, maybe 100,000, and I’m getting the sense that you think it is fine that NYC continues to be wide open, undefended, so that things can be ‘normal’ and so that you are satisfied that we don’t show the terrorists that they have an effect?

I have news for you: terrorist attacks have an effect. They killed a bunch of us here. Maybe your hometown is not a big target. Pretend in your mind that it is, and imagine that your town has been attacked and nearly attacked at least seven times since 1920 by terrorists killing thousands, raining destruction miles around in the most densely populated and developed county in the US, maybe the world. NYC is not just a bunch of people. It is an important, vital place to the USA and the world. Some attacks today can take the entire town out. You may not like us or care about us, but if we all get destroyed it is going to hurt your lifestyle, and if you think having some precautions here in NYC is too expensive and hurts your liberties, picture what this country will become like if NYC is taken out. New Yorkers could use your empathy and support.