Comments on: Rahm and the Torture Investigation http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/ Fri, 15 Jul 2011 20:48:32 -0500 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: MartyDidier http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181679 MartyDidier Mon, 17 Aug 2009 22:44:16 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181679 <p>Marcy, I took the time to watch your video. I want to offer that between you and I and everyone reading this, <strong>our prayers are being answered.</strong><em></em> There is something you don’t know that will make you happy. It happens to be linked with what you talked about but I’m not allowed to talk about it.</p> <p>Smile and be happy Marcy,<br /> Marty Didier<br /> Northbrook, IL</p> Marcy, I took the time to watch your video. I want to offer that between you and I and everyone reading this, our prayers are being answered. There is something you don’t know that will make you happy. It happens to be linked with what you talked about but I’m not allowed to talk about it.

Smile and be happy Marcy,
Marty Didier
Northbrook, IL

]]> By: bobschacht http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181669 bobschacht Mon, 17 Aug 2009 22:08:36 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181669 <p>OMG!</p> <p>*G*</p> <p>Bob in HI–>AZ</p> OMG!

*G*

Bob in HI–>AZ

]]> By: bobschacht http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181664 bobschacht Mon, 17 Aug 2009 21:59:53 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181664 <p>Wasn’t Ken Starr the last of the old-style “Special Prosecutors,” and wasn’t his misfeasance one of the primary reasons the old statute was allowed to expire?</p> <p>Bob in HI–>AZ</p> Wasn’t Ken Starr the last of the old-style “Special Prosecutors,” and wasn’t his misfeasance one of the primary reasons the old statute was allowed to expire?

Bob in HI–>AZ

]]> By: bobschacht http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181628 bobschacht Mon, 17 Aug 2009 21:07:22 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181628 <p>I suspect that, as a political strategist, Obama is a centrist; but his personal views are more progressive. If this is correct, at the moment, his personal views are obviously taking a back seat to his political strategy.</p> <p>Bob in HI</p> I suspect that, as a political strategist, Obama is a centrist; but his personal views are more progressive. If this is correct, at the moment, his personal views are obviously taking a back seat to his political strategy.

Bob in HI

]]> By: readerOfTeaLeaves http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181565 readerOfTeaLeaves Mon, 17 Aug 2009 20:31:00 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181565 <p>Yes, yes, and yes.</p> Yes, yes, and yes.

]]> By: Jeff Kaye http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181529 Jeff Kaye Mon, 17 Aug 2009 20:15:49 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181529 <p>IMHO, it is not just Rahm that stands in the way of prosecutions, though everything said about that aspect it true. Nor is it Obama’s centrist realpolitik, though there is that as well. Same goes with whatever Holder’s past is. I’d like to add in the influence of the generals and Pentagon, which is a lot more powerful in the WH than whatever Rahm or the Axe may think. That’s who says what goes on matters like this. Or Afghanistan. Or Iraq. The rest is an illusion.</p> <p>The U.S. government has become so corrupted by subservience to military and intelligence aims over the last sixty years, so enmeshed in the cover-ups for a thousand different crimes (see tjbs at #104 above for just one example) that to do anything more than prosecute the Lyndie Englands is dangerous. Even Mitchell and Jessen present dangers, as Marcy has pointed out, because the connections aren’t too many between them and Cheney’s office. And in between, an entire portion of the U.S. government that operates with practically no oversight: the CIA and Joint Special Operations Command. They spend billions, they assassinate, they torture, they “keep America safe for democracy.”</p> <p>Who is going to take <em>them</em> on? Obama? Holder? Feinstein? You? Me? Cheney is gone now. They are still there. I’m all for getting Cheney, but if we don’t address the fundamental, structural problems in this country, then the game is up.</p> IMHO, it is not just Rahm that stands in the way of prosecutions, though everything said about that aspect it true. Nor is it Obama’s centrist realpolitik, though there is that as well. Same goes with whatever Holder’s past is. I’d like to add in the influence of the generals and Pentagon, which is a lot more powerful in the WH than whatever Rahm or the Axe may think. That’s who says what goes on matters like this. Or Afghanistan. Or Iraq. The rest is an illusion.

The U.S. government has become so corrupted by subservience to military and intelligence aims over the last sixty years, so enmeshed in the cover-ups for a thousand different crimes (see tjbs at #104 above for just one example) that to do anything more than prosecute the Lyndie Englands is dangerous. Even Mitchell and Jessen present dangers, as Marcy has pointed out, because the connections aren’t too many between them and Cheney’s office. And in between, an entire portion of the U.S. government that operates with practically no oversight: the CIA and Joint Special Operations Command. They spend billions, they assassinate, they torture, they “keep America safe for democracy.”

Who is going to take them on? Obama? Holder? Feinstein? You? Me? Cheney is gone now. They are still there. I’m all for getting Cheney, but if we don’t address the fundamental, structural problems in this country, then the game is up.

]]> By: Jkat http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181528 Jkat Mon, 17 Aug 2009 20:15:48 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181528 <p>well bmaz .. if you’re in there ..at least i’ll be keeping good company ..<br /> so yeah .. i’m in ..and if i’m not here m’friend .. you have my proxy ..</p> well bmaz .. if you’re in there ..at least i’ll be keeping good company ..
so yeah .. i’m in ..and if i’m not here m’friend .. you have my proxy ..

]]> By: Jeff Kaye http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181513 Jeff Kaye Mon, 17 Aug 2009 20:06:29 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181513 <p>I think your are right about the political alignment the country needs. That alignment must be expressed in the organizational forms of the political parties. I, too, have called for a Democratic Party split, so the party can have a platform and a leadership to really getting change done, if such is possible in this country.</p> I think your are right about the political alignment the country needs. That alignment must be expressed in the organizational forms of the political parties. I, too, have called for a Democratic Party split, so the party can have a platform and a leadership to really getting change done, if such is possible in this country.

]]> By: klynn http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181510 klynn Mon, 17 Aug 2009 20:04:17 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181510 <blockquote><p>Next, Rahm has always been in bed with big corporate. </p></blockquote> <p>(snip)</p> <blockquote><p>And finally, Rahm is about Rahm. And he thinks his future will be brighter if he crafts a corporate-friendly solution here.</p></blockquote> <p>Marcy,</p> <p>I agree with you on these points. But with polls indicating that even moderate voters want a torture investigation; then, I still do not understand the politics of Rahm (and Axelrod). Aside from the corporate motivations (which are hugh motivations), in terms of a “winning route” with voters, in addition to progressives, Obama’s agenda and Rahm’s personal agenda, actually need torture investigations politically. Not going there is a dangerous bypass.</p> <p>By working to by-pass torture, he’ll (Rahm and Obama) write a political epitaph from a voter’s perspective. He can be taken down with all kinds rhetoric regarding human rights. The spin and the irony of where such spin would come from (the very ‘no torture investigation folks”) would be tragic historically.</p>

Next, Rahm has always been in bed with big corporate.

(snip)

And finally, Rahm is about Rahm. And he thinks his future will be brighter if he crafts a corporate-friendly solution here.

Marcy,

I agree with you on these points. But with polls indicating that even moderate voters want a torture investigation; then, I still do not understand the politics of Rahm (and Axelrod). Aside from the corporate motivations (which are hugh motivations), in terms of a “winning route” with voters, in addition to progressives, Obama’s agenda and Rahm’s personal agenda, actually need torture investigations politically. Not going there is a dangerous bypass.

By working to by-pass torture, he’ll (Rahm and Obama) write a political epitaph from a voter’s perspective. He can be taken down with all kinds rhetoric regarding human rights. The spin and the irony of where such spin would come from (the very ‘no torture investigation folks”) would be tragic historically.

]]> By: bmaz http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181508 bmaz Mon, 17 Aug 2009 20:03:18 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/08/17/rahm-and-the-torture-investigation/#comment-181508 <p>I have not heard of it often, but when GJs start taking things into their own hands they are termed “runaways”. This usually results in the presiding judge slapping them down or disbanding them.</p> I have not heard of it often, but when GJs start taking things into their own hands they are termed “runaways”. This usually results in the presiding judge slapping them down or disbanding them.

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