My guess ..they would both be good sources of information. ..before a grand jury. I think they were both complicit with some unlawful acts…but there are degrees of evil.

Richard Clarke apoplogized for 9/11. George Tenet sitting behing Colin Powell at the UN did not look like a happy camper..listening to the drum beat for war.

One person Gerson suggested consulting was Robert Joseph, a neocon plant (at State? I can’t remember) who shepherded the uraniumaluminum tubes “intelligence”.

Blair never got his resolution, see US, Britain and Spain Abandon Resolution.

The real issue concerning the UN and torture is the United Nations Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, which Congress ratified in 1994. Others have written about this, but I’m working up something on another possibly new angle.

Good sleuthing, folks!

You are so correct! After I wrote that, I realized Gerson was G Bush’s chief speech writer at that time. I knew he wrote the 2003 speech and worked on Powell’s smoking gun speech and the SOTU speech. What I understood was “that” 2002 UN speech was written by a team which included Gerson, the Iraq group.

The Sept. 12 speech, a half hour or less in length, was written by a team that included Mr. Bush’s chief speechwriter, Michael Gerson; Condoleezza Rice, the national security adviser; Secretary of Defense Donald H. Rumsfeld; and Secretary of State Colin L. Powell.

What I should have written is “who” Gerson consulted with outside the group as he helped write the UN speech — that consult individual(s) is key. It appears to me there could have been such a contact.

I also wonder who suggested the UNESCO rejoining issue? It is an interesting turn at the beginning of the speech and one that has not been fully addressed. That turn becomes even more interesting when you match that to the torture timeline.

If anything, Ron Paul was probably being more honest about why we should not be members in UNESCO.

Weeds or not, this is probably an area which should be tied into the torture timeline, which is what this thread is addressing to a degree.

President Bush announced his decision that the United States would rejoin UNESCO in a Sept. 12 speech before the United Nations General Assembly that drew attention worldwide for its call for a strong international stand against Iraq. Mr. Bush’s UNESCO news, coming early in the speech, was seen as a conciliatory move toward the listening countries, many of whose representatives had entered the chamber unhappy about what they see as Mr. Bush’s tendency to go it alone on international issues.

“As a symbol of our commitment to human dignity, the United States will return to UNESCO,” Mr. Bush said. “The organization has been reformed, and America will participate fully in its mission to advance human rights and tolerance and learning.”

Then from the whole speech to the UN:

In 1991, the U.N. Security Council through Resolution 687 demanded that Iraq renounce all involvement with terrorism and permit no terrorist organizations to operate in Iraq.

Iraq’s regime agreed that broke this promise.

Last year, the U.N. Commission on Human Rights found that Iraq continues to commit extremely grave violations of human rights and that the regime’s repression is all-pervasive.

Tens of thousands of political opponents and ordinary citizens have been subjected to arbitrary arrest and imprisonment, summary execution and torture by beating and burning, electric shock, starvation, mutilation and rape.

Wives are tortured in front of their husbands; children in the presence of their parents; and all of these horrors concealed from the world by the apparatus of a totalitarian state.

(snip)

In violation of Security Council Resolution 1373, Iraq continues to shelter and support terrorist organizations that direct violence against Iran, Israel and Western governments. Iraqi dissidents abroad are targeted for murder.

(snip)

Iraq has made several attempts to buy high-strength aluminum tubes used to enrich uranium for a nuclear weapon. Should Iraq acquire fissile material, it would be able to build a nuclear weapon within a year.

Colin Powell’s speech did not happen until Feb 5th, 2003.

It would be interesting to confirm who wrote this speech Bush delivered to the UN. This person knows everything.

I think you’re way out in the weeds trying to link this bill introduced by Ron Paul to any kind of conspiracy to cover up torture. Ron Paul has consistently opposed torture and the Iraq war.

From Congressman Ron Paul, House of Representatives, November 29, 2001:

The drumbeat for attacking Baghdad grows louder every day, with Paul Wolfowitz, Bill Kristol, Richard Perle, and Bill Bennett leading the charge. In a recent interview, U.S. Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz, made it clear: “We are going to continue pursuing the entire al Qaeda network which is in 60 countries, not just Afghanistan.” Fortunately, President Bush and Colin Powell so far have resisted the pressure to expand the war into other countries. Let us hope and pray that they do not yield to the clamor of the special interests that want us to take on Iraq.

And later in the same speech:

It is estimated that approximately 1,200 men have been arrested as a consequence of 9-11, yet their names and the charges are not available, and according to Ashcroft, will not be made available. Once again, he uses the argument that he’s protecting the privacy of those charged. Unbelievable! Due process for the detainees has been denied. Secret government is winning out over open government. This is the largest number of people to be locked up under these conditions since FDR’s internment of Japanese-Americans during World War II. Information regarding these arrests is a must, in a constitutional republic. If they’re terrorists or accomplices, just let the public know and pursue their prosecution. But secret arrests and silence are not acceptable in a society that professes to be free.