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	<title>Comments on: Philip Zelikow: How BushCo Gamed the Briefing Process</title>
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	<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/</link>
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		<title>By: Lizinbklyn</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157573</link>
		<dc:creator>Lizinbklyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 17:35:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157573</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;This hearing was NOT even mentioned in Rupert Murdick’s NEW YORK POST today . .&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Anyone surprised?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This hearing was NOT even mentioned in Rupert Murdick’s NEW YORK POST today . .</p>
<p>Anyone surprised?</p>
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		<title>By: radiofreewill</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157516</link>
		<dc:creator>radiofreewill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 16:37:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157516</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I’m going to take a semi-wild-assed guess that the ‘CIA Member Briefings Document’ is actually a Clever Prop in the World’s Biggest and Slowest RICO Case - designed to put the Goopers - and any involved Crooked Politician, really - on the Horns of a Dilemma:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The Member Briefings Report is cloudy, at best, on Dem Complicity, but it clearly says that the Goopers were given knowledge of a War Crime by Bush - Waterboarding Zubaydah - before Informing Congress.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So, do the Goopers speak-up and Say they were Complicit back then, or keep quiet and Show that they’re Still Complicit now? &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;That’s really the Major Action, imvho, that’s going on in these Hearings. It’s not about the witnesses - What’s really going on is everyone is ‘watching’ the behavior of the Goopers to ’see’ them Willfully Ignoring Bush’s War Crime of Waterboarding Zubaydah, without properly informing Congress beforehand.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And so, what do We see? Lindsay Graham shows-up to a hearing on Torture with his hands in his pockets, and just whistles his way through the proceedings without even the slightest acknowledgment of Bush’s Obvious Crime.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;That’s interesting information in and of itself.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I’m going to take a semi-wild-assed guess that the ‘CIA Member Briefings Document’ is actually a Clever Prop in the World’s Biggest and Slowest RICO Case &#8211; designed to put the Goopers &#8211; and any involved Crooked Politician, really &#8211; on the Horns of a Dilemma:</p>
<p>The Member Briefings Report is cloudy, at best, on Dem Complicity, but it clearly says that the Goopers were given knowledge of a War Crime by Bush &#8211; Waterboarding Zubaydah &#8211; before Informing Congress.</p>
<p>So, do the Goopers speak-up and Say they were Complicit back then, or keep quiet and Show that they’re Still Complicit now? </p>
<p>That’s really the Major Action, imvho, that’s going on in these Hearings. It’s not about the witnesses &#8211; What’s really going on is everyone is ‘watching’ the behavior of the Goopers to ’see’ them Willfully Ignoring Bush’s War Crime of Waterboarding Zubaydah, without properly informing Congress beforehand.</p>
<p>And so, what do We see? Lindsay Graham shows-up to a hearing on Torture with his hands in his pockets, and just whistles his way through the proceedings without even the slightest acknowledgment of Bush’s Obvious Crime.</p>
<p>That’s interesting information in and of itself.</p>
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		<title>By: readerOfTeaLeaves</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157456</link>
		<dc:creator>readerOfTeaLeaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 15:15:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157456</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt; But is that business as usual to keep reminding everyone that he has a plane to catch and we need to wrap it up? Seems like he could have set some time between the first hearing and his next appointment&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Good point; there should have been more ‘give’ in Whitehouse’s schedule, but OTOH if he’d walked out with no explanation that would not have been acceptable.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The good news is that from what I can tell catching up, this hearing was really a stunner.&lt;br /&gt;
And a first step.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p> But is that business as usual to keep reminding everyone that he has a plane to catch and we need to wrap it up? Seems like he could have set some time between the first hearing and his next appointment</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Good point; there should have been more ‘give’ in Whitehouse’s schedule, but OTOH if he’d walked out with no explanation that would not have been acceptable.</p>
<p>The good news is that from what I can tell catching up, this hearing was really a stunner.<br />
And a first step.</p>
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		<title>By: readerOfTeaLeaves</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157454</link>
		<dc:creator>readerOfTeaLeaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 15:13:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157454</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Will catch up on thread comments later, but wanted to comment that Durbin’s brilliant remarks really hit almost dead center on what I see as  a key problem: the people who know are precluded from divulging.  Which means they’re basically pawns in the hands of those (like Cheney, like GW Bush) who use that fact to manipulate, disempower, and compromise people in justice, the military, and the Congress.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Durbin raises a complex, disturbing, and critical issue.&lt;br /&gt;
IMHO, this is a gutsy, profound question-observation.&lt;br /&gt;
I hope it’s followed up, because it surely hits the heart of a very dark nexis of problems.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will catch up on thread comments later, but wanted to comment that Durbin’s brilliant remarks really hit almost dead center on what I see as  a key problem: the people who know are precluded from divulging.  Which means they’re basically pawns in the hands of those (like Cheney, like GW Bush) who use that fact to manipulate, disempower, and compromise people in justice, the military, and the Congress.</p>
<p>Durbin raises a complex, disturbing, and critical issue.<br />
IMHO, this is a gutsy, profound question-observation.<br />
I hope it’s followed up, because it surely hits the heart of a very dark nexis of problems.</p>
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		<title>By: Leen</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157355</link>
		<dc:creator>Leen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 12:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157355</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;During Zellikow’s last appearance on Rachel’s my sense was that he was attempting to not only provide cover for himself and Condi but for Bush, Cheney, Addington, Yoo, etc.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/04/22/zelikows-destroyed-memos/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://emptywheel.firedoglake......yed-memos/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Zellikow “unchartered waters”&lt;br /&gt;
“murky area of the law”&lt;br /&gt;
(“I’m just one point of view”&lt;br /&gt;
“of course just offering my opinion”&lt;br /&gt;
“perfectly entitled to hear an alternative opinion”&lt;br /&gt;
“they weren’t commiting an obstruction of justice by trying to destroy copies of the memos”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Zellikow “I don’t know why they wanted to do it”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;“all it shows is that they were presented with an argument that says your interpretation of the law appears to this one fellow to be unsound”&lt;br /&gt;
————————————————————————&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Will we ever find out what Soufan was attempting to say when he was interrupted three times by Lindsay “I support International treaties” except when it comes to the U.S. Graham.  Then Soufan was interrupted again by Whitehouse because he had to get in his shtick before he rushed off to catch a plane.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Don’t get me wrong I hang onto everything Whitehouse says and sounds like he actually believes.  But is that business as usual to keep reminding everyone that he has a plane to catch and we need to wrap it up?  Seems like he could have set some time between the first hearing and his next appointment&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>During Zellikow’s last appearance on Rachel’s my sense was that he was attempting to not only provide cover for himself and Condi but for Bush, Cheney, Addington, Yoo, etc.<br /><a href="http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/04/22/zelikows-destroyed-memos/" rel="nofollow">http://emptywheel.firedoglake&#8230;&#8230;yed-memos/</a></p>
<p>Zellikow “unchartered waters”<br />
“murky area of the law”<br />
(“I’m just one point of view”<br />
“of course just offering my opinion”<br />
“perfectly entitled to hear an alternative opinion”<br />
“they weren’t commiting an obstruction of justice by trying to destroy copies of the memos”</p>
<p>Zellikow “I don’t know why they wanted to do it”</p>
<p>“all it shows is that they were presented with an argument that says your interpretation of the law appears to this one fellow to be unsound”<br />
————————————————————————</p>
<p>Will we ever find out what Soufan was attempting to say when he was interrupted three times by Lindsay “I support International treaties” except when it comes to the U.S. Graham.  Then Soufan was interrupted again by Whitehouse because he had to get in his shtick before he rushed off to catch a plane.</p>
<p>Don’t get me wrong I hang onto everything Whitehouse says and sounds like he actually believes.  But is that business as usual to keep reminding everyone that he has a plane to catch and we need to wrap it up?  Seems like he could have set some time between the first hearing and his next appointment</p>
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		<title>By: Leen</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157352</link>
		<dc:creator>Leen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 12:36:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157352</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;“appears” sure jumped out at me.  Thanks&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“appears” sure jumped out at me.  Thanks</p>
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		<title>By: skdadl</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157343</link>
		<dc:creator>skdadl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 10:54:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157343</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I won’t even try to watch, cinnamon; I believe you too well.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;It’s a shame that Luban didn’t catch Graham out on that lie (”cell” for “confinement box/coffin”). I was shouting into my monitor — lot of good that did.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I won’t even try to watch, cinnamon; I believe you too well.</p>
<p>It’s a shame that Luban didn’t catch Graham out on that lie (”cell” for “confinement box/coffin”). I was shouting into my monitor — lot of good that did.</p>
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		<title>By: freepatriot</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157319</link>
		<dc:creator>freepatriot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 06:03:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157319</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;an ew, by now, you shoulda received the ducats I sent&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;jes so ya know&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;BEST MONEY I EVER SPENT&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;em&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
an I sent money to Digby, so that’s sayin a lot …&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>an ew, by now, you shoulda received the ducats I sent</p>
<p>jes so ya know</p>
<p><strong>BEST MONEY I EVER SPENT</strong></p>
<p><em><br />
an I sent money to Digby, so that’s sayin a lot …</em></p>
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		<title>By: freepatriot</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157318</link>
		<dc:creator>freepatriot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 06:00:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157318</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;stuff like that exceeds my authority&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;besides, they pay me in stale leftover pizza*, so I ain’t as dedicated to the job as I could be …&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;em&gt;*I thought I was hiring that Drew Rosenhaus guy to negotiate my contract, turns out I hired a guy named DAVE Rosenhaus. He aint as good as Drew, apparently …&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>stuff like that exceeds my authority</p>
<p>besides, they pay me in stale leftover pizza*, so I ain’t as dedicated to the job as I could be …</p>
<p><em>*I thought I was hiring that Drew Rosenhaus guy to negotiate my contract, turns out I hired a guy named DAVE Rosenhaus. He aint as good as Drew, apparently …</em></p>
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		<title>By: Dalybean</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157304</link>
		<dc:creator>Dalybean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 04:48:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/13/philip-zelikow-how-bushco-gamed-the-briefing-process/#comment-157304</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I wasn’t really saying that Zelikow was lying.  What he did say was picked up as inaccurate by Marcy immediately.  In an earlier thread I had wondered if Zelikow stressing the importance of timelines was a tribute to Marcy’s timeline work in addition to her award today.  When I read this post, I knew that Zelikow has not been paying enough attention to Marcy’s work or he would have known she would catch his vagueness and publish it, as she does here.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wasn’t really saying that Zelikow was lying.  What he did say was picked up as inaccurate by Marcy immediately.  In an earlier thread I had wondered if Zelikow stressing the importance of timelines was a tribute to Marcy’s timeline work in addition to her award today.  When I read this post, I knew that Zelikow has not been paying enough attention to Marcy’s work or he would have known she would catch his vagueness and publish it, as she does here.</p>
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