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	<title>Comments on: The New Journalism</title>
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	<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/</link>
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		<title>By: radiofreewill</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154732</link>
		<dc:creator>radiofreewill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 23:03:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154732</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I’m late to the party, but We need 2,000 more donations of $50 to make it to the Goal of $150,000 to support Marcy Wheeler and Our Own homegrown, organic News, Analysis and Blogging!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I’ve given once, but I’ll give again - by matching anyone who hasn’t yet donated - up to $50!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Just high-five me in the comments and I’ll back my little red wagon full of coins up to the Emptywheel Blogging Syndicate receiving dock…&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;We can do this!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I’m late to the party, but We need 2,000 more donations of $50 to make it to the Goal of $150,000 to support Marcy Wheeler and Our Own homegrown, organic News, Analysis and Blogging!</p>
<p>I’ve given once, but I’ll give again &#8211; by matching anyone who hasn’t yet donated &#8211; up to $50!</p>
<p>Just high-five me in the comments and I’ll back my little red wagon full of coins up to the Emptywheel Blogging Syndicate receiving dock…</p>
<p>We can do this!</p>
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		<title>By: Clovis</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154706</link>
		<dc:creator>Clovis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 21:08:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154706</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Do you think there might be some advantage to brakes in evolution? The grocer in Kansas City who invented the roller cart was surprised nobody took advantage of it. So he had to range about his store pushing one so the practice would catch on. And in drag racing, they had these huge fire-belching constant explosions blocking the view of the driver in those rail jobs, and one driver mused when finally a sensible design came out; “I understand what placed the driver where he was [convention]; what I don’t know is what keeps him there.” And in my hot muggy part of the world while growing up, there was a quick food franchise which offered the very first open-air dining in our town, and in the spring it was cool and bug-free of an evening, and the tables sat vacant. Because everyone had always dined inside.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And now folks still insist their news be in the form of ink spread on dead trees. After all, it’s always been like that.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you think there might be some advantage to brakes in evolution? The grocer in Kansas City who invented the roller cart was surprised nobody took advantage of it. So he had to range about his store pushing one so the practice would catch on. And in drag racing, they had these huge fire-belching constant explosions blocking the view of the driver in those rail jobs, and one driver mused when finally a sensible design came out; “I understand what placed the driver where he was [convention]; what I don’t know is what keeps him there.” And in my hot muggy part of the world while growing up, there was a quick food franchise which offered the very first open-air dining in our town, and in the spring it was cool and bug-free of an evening, and the tables sat vacant. Because everyone had always dined inside.</p>
<p>And now folks still insist their news be in the form of ink spread on dead trees. After all, it’s always been like that.</p>
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		<title>By: RoyalOak</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154687</link>
		<dc:creator>RoyalOak</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 19:59:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154687</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Viet Nam was covered from the government’s perspective (with one or two exceptions - Cronkite was one as I recall) until more and more of us protested.  That protesting turned the MSM into reporting more than propagandizing.  They merely followed the turning tide.  I remember how angry I would get at the news back then - but the protests got larger and larger and they had to cover them.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Viet Nam was covered from the government’s perspective (with one or two exceptions &#8211; Cronkite was one as I recall) until more and more of us protested.  That protesting turned the MSM into reporting more than propagandizing.  They merely followed the turning tide.  I remember how angry I would get at the news back then &#8211; but the protests got larger and larger and they had to cover them.</p>
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		<title>By: Hugh</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154683</link>
		<dc:creator>Hugh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 19:43:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154683</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think the impetus for the development of the blogosphere was precisely the fact that newspapers and the rest of the media weren’t putting out news but propaganda.  Who wants to pay to be spun?  Again it is difficult to tell pre-internet if this was always the case, but with the internet, the news media as propagandist and infotainment just wasn’t a viable business model.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But it isn’t just content but presentation where the MSM fail.  The Huffington Post has been successful although it’s kind of light weight and glitzy.  Dailykos has been successful too although it is often limited by traditional partisan affiliations.  But quite obviously both of these give readers something that they want.  They are addressing the wants of an audience.  When was the last time you ever heard the MSM talk about its audience?  Not numbers but who it is they are trying to reach?  That I think is the point.  The media no longer know who they want to reach or how to reach them.  As a result, that audience is looking for alternatives and it is increasingly finding them on the internet.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;It doesn’t hurt that many of these sell themselves as free, even if this really isn’t the case.  If you look at the cost of computers, network connections, portals, etc., the internet is not free.  In fact, it can be fairly expensive.  But the difference is that now it is not the NYT or Boston Globe that is telling you what you need to know and doing a very poor job of it, it is you who are calling the shots, and maybe you like glitz or the Democratic line or something else but those are your choices, good or bad.  The MSM thought they had a captive audience.  They were wrong. The evidence is that they have yet to internalize that lesson.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the impetus for the development of the blogosphere was precisely the fact that newspapers and the rest of the media weren’t putting out news but propaganda.  Who wants to pay to be spun?  Again it is difficult to tell pre-internet if this was always the case, but with the internet, the news media as propagandist and infotainment just wasn’t a viable business model.  </p>
<p>But it isn’t just content but presentation where the MSM fail.  The Huffington Post has been successful although it’s kind of light weight and glitzy.  Dailykos has been successful too although it is often limited by traditional partisan affiliations.  But quite obviously both of these give readers something that they want.  They are addressing the wants of an audience.  When was the last time you ever heard the MSM talk about its audience?  Not numbers but who it is they are trying to reach?  That I think is the point.  The media no longer know who they want to reach or how to reach them.  As a result, that audience is looking for alternatives and it is increasingly finding them on the internet.  </p>
<p>It doesn’t hurt that many of these sell themselves as free, even if this really isn’t the case.  If you look at the cost of computers, network connections, portals, etc., the internet is not free.  In fact, it can be fairly expensive.  But the difference is that now it is not the NYT or Boston Globe that is telling you what you need to know and doing a very poor job of it, it is you who are calling the shots, and maybe you like glitz or the Democratic line or something else but those are your choices, good or bad.  The MSM thought they had a captive audience.  They were wrong. The evidence is that they have yet to internalize that lesson.</p>
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		<title>By: decotodd</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154680</link>
		<dc:creator>decotodd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 19:27:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154680</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think most of the points I would make have been made. However, a couple of things: &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;1. It is true that 24 cable news and the internet have made much of what newspapers cover stale. However, that should have been a wake up call years ago for the papers to devote more reporting on stories that no one else is doing. Some stories require timely/newsbreaking coverage (e.g. a bombing) that is best served by tv but there are plenty of stories that either do not require that kind of immediate time frame(e.g. Harman’s wiretapping story) or mainstream stories that warrant in-depth analysis (Marcy’s footnote discovery by doing real reporting; how many talking heads had actually read any of the memos or reports they covered?). Too many tv news stories are the equivalent of hit-and-run: sound bite today, forgotten tomorrow. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Speaking of hit-and-run stories, what’s going on with Meirs/Rove/Card testimony? &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;2. I think one of the posters above was on to something. I think the MSM has always been a bit ‘establishment’. I was reading a book over the summer about the WPA theater program, and there was plenty of anti-FDR bias in the main stream news accounts. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I know there are many who long wistfully for the days of Cronkite/Mudd/Reasoner, but I wonder if they aren’t just being nostalgic for something that was never as substantive as they imagine. I’d like to watch some old telecasts of nightly news to see how early Watergate or Vietname was covered.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think most of the points I would make have been made. However, a couple of things: </p>
<p>1. It is true that 24 cable news and the internet have made much of what newspapers cover stale. However, that should have been a wake up call years ago for the papers to devote more reporting on stories that no one else is doing. Some stories require timely/newsbreaking coverage (e.g. a bombing) that is best served by tv but there are plenty of stories that either do not require that kind of immediate time frame(e.g. Harman’s wiretapping story) or mainstream stories that warrant in-depth analysis (Marcy’s footnote discovery by doing real reporting; how many talking heads had actually read any of the memos or reports they covered?). Too many tv news stories are the equivalent of hit-and-run: sound bite today, forgotten tomorrow. </p>
<p>Speaking of hit-and-run stories, what’s going on with Meirs/Rove/Card testimony? </p>
<p>2. I think one of the posters above was on to something. I think the MSM has always been a bit ‘establishment’. I was reading a book over the summer about the WPA theater program, and there was plenty of anti-FDR bias in the main stream news accounts. </p>
<p>I know there are many who long wistfully for the days of Cronkite/Mudd/Reasoner, but I wonder if they aren’t just being nostalgic for something that was never as substantive as they imagine. I’d like to watch some old telecasts of nightly news to see how early Watergate or Vietname was covered.</p>
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		<title>By: cathy</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154676</link>
		<dc:creator>cathy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 19:00:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154676</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The dying newspaper trend is like which came first, the chicken or the egg.&lt;br /&gt;
I stopped reading the paper when it started sounding like the Bush admin garbage. I noticed that it was garbage when I started reading news on the internet. Would I have gravitated toward the internet anyway? All I know is that the more fed up with the paper I became, the more solace I found on the internet.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The dying newspaper trend is like which came first, the chicken or the egg.<br />
I stopped reading the paper when it started sounding like the Bush admin garbage. I noticed that it was garbage when I started reading news on the internet. Would I have gravitated toward the internet anyway? All I know is that the more fed up with the paper I became, the more solace I found on the internet.</p>
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		<title>By: RIRedinPA</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154674</link>
		<dc:creator>RIRedinPA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 18:45:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154674</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The paper should just stop printing and save 1/3 of their cost (which includes delivery) and lock all subscribers into a 3 year deal, $300 per year, monthly fee. Fat penalty for canceling early, like with cable or your phone service.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;With that you get a new Kindle DX. (Retail $489, probably work a deal with Bezos sub $400 per) but no paper delivery. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Then work a deal with Amazon that every purchase made through a NYT subscriber, 1% is given to the Times.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The paper should just stop printing and save 1/3 of their cost (which includes delivery) and lock all subscribers into a 3 year deal, $300 per year, monthly fee. Fat penalty for canceling early, like with cable or your phone service.</p>
<p>With that you get a new Kindle DX. (Retail $489, probably work a deal with Bezos sub $400 per) but no paper delivery. </p>
<p>Then work a deal with Amazon that every purchase made through a NYT subscriber, 1% is given to the Times.</p>
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		<title>By: ratfood</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154660</link>
		<dc:creator>ratfood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 17:48:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154660</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;reply to eCAHNomics @ 75&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;You’re right, the MSM has always been pro-establishment. You might recall that for a long time the coverage of the Civil Rights Movement was from the perspective of law enforcement. People were going out and being disruptive and when trouble found them they were getting what they deserved. It wasn’t until the Birmingham church bombings in ‘63 that the narrative (slowly) began to change.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>reply to eCAHNomics @ 75</p>
<p>You’re right, the MSM has always been pro-establishment. You might recall that for a long time the coverage of the Civil Rights Movement was from the perspective of law enforcement. People were going out and being disruptive and when trouble found them they were getting what they deserved. It wasn’t until the Birmingham church bombings in ‘63 that the narrative (slowly) began to change.</p>
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		<title>By: Rayne</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154659</link>
		<dc:creator>Rayne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 17:48:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154659</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Thanks for that, could be very interesting testimony. Especially when AP and other outlets chronically whine Google is poaching their content.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(I want to say to them, &lt;em&gt;Um, no, morons, Google is marketing your content for you at a very reasonable price, accessing the market you’d otherwise lose altogether&lt;/em&gt;…)&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for that, could be very interesting testimony. Especially when AP and other outlets chronically whine Google is poaching their content.</p>
<p>(I want to say to them, <em>Um, no, morons, Google is marketing your content for you at a very reasonable price, accessing the market you’d otherwise lose altogether</em>…)</p>
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		<title>By: bowtiejack</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/comment-page-1/#comment-154658</link>
		<dc:creator>bowtiejack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 May 2009 17:46:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2009/05/05/the-new-journalism/#comment-154658</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;When I moved to New York 14 years ago, one of the things I looked forward to was going by my local newsstand and picking up the NY Times every day.  After Judy Miller, I simply stopped buying the Times. Propaganda indeed.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I moved to New York 14 years ago, one of the things I looked forward to was going by my local newsstand and picking up the NY Times every day.  After Judy Miller, I simply stopped buying the Times. Propaganda indeed.</p>
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