I’ve been making a mental list of all those I’ve heard so far, either from the administration or from the media, argue that what is described in the four memos is not “torture”. To anyone I hear say this, I ask, “Have you read the memos?” If they say “No, but …”, I say STFU and go read the memos so you don’t make an idiot of yourself. If they say “yes”, and still argue that what this program administered does not constitute “torture”, I refuse to argue with them. Why waste the time? I just put their name on the list.

I think someone should put up such a list on the web. It would greatly simplify this whole debate.

Has it ever occurred to Ms. Cheyney that a Democratic Congress that had a spine and only a little less principle than the one we have now might at some point think that waterboarding her old man would yield a treasure trove of politically useful “information”? That said Congress might plausibly want to waterboard HER in order to further pressure her father? That it might be convenient for the Democratic establishment if Cheyney could be made to confess sole responsibility for war, torture, economic collapse economy, and maybe global warming?

If it has not occurred to her, then I’m suggesting it now. If we are so far gone as to accept ANY justification for what Cheyney, Bush, and their minions did to men, women, and their children, then we need to use the new Cheyney toolset on its originators. Equal protection. There are cells in the Capitol basement, I’m told. I’m betting that there is running water and electricity too. Moistened copies of old Yoo memos can serve in place of towels.

In early 2002, no doubt Condi was still trying to prove herself to the boys’ club of Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz et all. It probably didn’t help that Steve Hadley, her “deputy” was also one of the neocon flock. It probably didn’t help that Cheney and his staff were :bcc’d on all of the NSC’s e-mail.

“Condi went along because she didn’t know any better” was the storyline I think Phil Zelikow was trying to plant yesterday and the day before.

But Condi did eventually wisen up.

I’ve shared this before, but I was told by a friend who served in the NSC that, on more than one occasion, Rumsfeld actually turned the lights off in offices and conference rooms where meetings with Dr. Rice had occurred, and where she remained sitting after the meetings. No respect.

I think maybe Dick and Rummy conned Condi into giving the first official approval, as a rite of initiation to the Boys Club of Manly Men, so I predict that Condi will eventually produce something to show that they put her up to it. She was never particularly close to either of them, anyway, IIRC.

Makes sense, and it’ll be very interesting to see whether she can muster a Get Out Of Jail Free card as you suggest. On reflection, I’m basically seeing the old Team W vs. Team Dick split. W couldn’t care less if Dick, Rummy, Addington, Bybee, and Yoo all go down, though per the family CIA ties W would probably not be happy to see any agency regulars impacted. Condi was definitely part of Team W at first, though maybe a jettisonable part at this point; maybe yesterday’s WaPo Condi/Dick piece was in part a Team Dick attempt at dragging her down along with them.

She should have also called BS on the “DNI was censored” as well.

I would have like to have seen O’Donnell on with Mini-Cheney at the same time. Better yet I’d love to see Marcy take one of these liars. They would not know what hit them. Like I said yesterday – I’d do pay per view for that.