Comments on: When The Levee Breaks http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/ Fri, 15 Jul 2011 20:48:32 -0500 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: bmaz http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96128 bmaz Mon, 25 Aug 2008 04:14:22 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96128 <p>You know, I don’t disagree with what you said in the general sense in the least. The line wasn’t penned over what he did in general, however, it was specifically in his use of New Orleans. He really did bootstrap himself on the backs of New Orleans and the Ninth Ward, not only played his original announcement off of their plight, but went and made a big production of it, and then went and did it again at the tail end of his campaign. Now it is all gone and what did they get out of it but used? I liked Edwards a lot, still do; but I have some hefty disappointment too.</p> You know, I don’t disagree with what you said in the general sense in the least. The line wasn’t penned over what he did in general, however, it was specifically in his use of New Orleans. He really did bootstrap himself on the backs of New Orleans and the Ninth Ward, not only played his original announcement off of their plight, but went and made a big production of it, and then went and did it again at the tail end of his campaign. Now it is all gone and what did they get out of it but used? I liked Edwards a lot, still do; but I have some hefty disappointment too.

]]> By: bobschacht http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96126 bobschacht Mon, 25 Aug 2008 03:25:40 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96126 <p>Dang, bmaz, I was 100% with you until I got to this:</p> <blockquote><p>Now both the Edwards medium and message are down the crapper with his political future, abandoned by him along the road of personal lust and indiscretion.</p></blockquote> <p>Sanctimonious scolding sounds hypocritical from the mouths of Republican Holier Than Thou folks, but it doesn’t sound too good coming from Lefties, either.</p> <p>OK, let me draw a picture in the sand here. Anyone who has never cheated on his/her spouse can line up to throw stones here– as long as you throw those stones with equal vigor at your friends who have committed a marital indiscretion. </p> <p>I don’t like what Edwards did when he cheated on his wife the way he did. But that doesn’t distract, for me, from what was probably the best overall presidential candidate platform of all the challengers, including Clinton’s and Obama’s. Edwards’ personal peccadillo does not diminish the value of his platform. And for that reason, I leave my Edwards bumper sticker on my car. It still represents for me the wisdom and compassion encapsulated in that platform. The Edwards have suffered enough. Let’s not indulge in piling on.</p> <p>Bob in HI</p> Dang, bmaz, I was 100% with you until I got to this:

Now both the Edwards medium and message are down the crapper with his political future, abandoned by him along the road of personal lust and indiscretion.

Sanctimonious scolding sounds hypocritical from the mouths of Republican Holier Than Thou folks, but it doesn’t sound too good coming from Lefties, either.

OK, let me draw a picture in the sand here. Anyone who has never cheated on his/her spouse can line up to throw stones here– as long as you throw those stones with equal vigor at your friends who have committed a marital indiscretion.

I don’t like what Edwards did when he cheated on his wife the way he did. But that doesn’t distract, for me, from what was probably the best overall presidential candidate platform of all the challengers, including Clinton’s and Obama’s. Edwards’ personal peccadillo does not diminish the value of his platform. And for that reason, I leave my Edwards bumper sticker on my car. It still represents for me the wisdom and compassion encapsulated in that platform. The Edwards have suffered enough. Let’s not indulge in piling on.

Bob in HI

]]> By: 4jkb4ia http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96111 4jkb4ia Mon, 25 Aug 2008 00:15:08 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96111 <p>Never mind. Plessy may not have been from New Orleans, but the group that conceived the suit certainly was.</p> Never mind. Plessy may not have been from New Orleans, but the group that conceived the suit certainly was.

]]> By: 4jkb4ia http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96107 4jkb4ia Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:40:51 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96107 <p>Perhaps this is so EPUd that I won’t get in trouble. I actually like the symbolism of having the VP event in Springfield. It has intimations of coming back to where it all began, both the campaign and Obama’s political career, and asking the new person to join the journey.<br /> I think you want the focus to be on the VP pick. If the focus is both on the pick and the city where it is held the media can’t cover two things at once.<br /> When you think about the symbolism of Springfield and Abraham Lincoln, this contrasts very unfavorably with the symbolism of New Orleans about that same time. New Orleans is known for having the greatest upper class of free blacks, many of whom were Creoles, i.e. of mixed race. <a href="http://www.loyno.edu/history/journal/1991-2/battle.htm" rel="nofollow">This link</a> shows that with all their education and wealth, this group was unable to be very effective in fighting for civil rights during the period between 1865 and <i>Plessy v. Ferguson</i>. In fact, Homer Plessy was from New Orleans. By 1867 Louisiana was under firm white control where other states such as South Carolina and Virginia had more federal supervision and more black political power. I think that came out as not something that belongs on No Quarter instead of here.</p> Perhaps this is so EPUd that I won’t get in trouble. I actually like the symbolism of having the VP event in Springfield. It has intimations of coming back to where it all began, both the campaign and Obama’s political career, and asking the new person to join the journey.
I think you want the focus to be on the VP pick. If the focus is both on the pick and the city where it is held the media can’t cover two things at once.
When you think about the symbolism of Springfield and Abraham Lincoln, this contrasts very unfavorably with the symbolism of New Orleans about that same time. New Orleans is known for having the greatest upper class of free blacks, many of whom were Creoles, i.e. of mixed race. This link shows that with all their education and wealth, this group was unable to be very effective in fighting for civil rights during the period between 1865 and Plessy v. Ferguson. In fact, Homer Plessy was from New Orleans. By 1867 Louisiana was under firm white control where other states such as South Carolina and Virginia had more federal supervision and more black political power. I think that came out as not something that belongs on No Quarter instead of here.

]]> By: freepatriot http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96100 freepatriot Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:17:38 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96100 <p>if Obama’s Veep selection makes you nervous after 7 years of George bush and john mcsame fucking up everything the touch</p> <p><strong>YOU’RE A FUCKING IDIOT !!!</strong></p> <p>if you like, I’m offering to punch you in the head to clear the STOOOOOOOPID away</p> <p>this is a FREE service …</p> <p>anybody ???</p> if Obama’s Veep selection makes you nervous after 7 years of George bush and john mcsame fucking up everything the touch

YOU’RE A FUCKING IDIOT !!!

if you like, I’m offering to punch you in the head to clear the STOOOOOOOPID away

this is a FREE service …

anybody ???

]]> By: randiego http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96089 randiego Sun, 24 Aug 2008 22:00:47 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96089 <blockquote><p>So how is everyone feeling about Obama this November after the VP selection? With some of the things he has said and done since defeating Hillary I’m still not convinced he’s going to be much different if elected.</p></blockquote> <p>I’m feeling pretty good. i like the pick. </p> <p>Does anyone here really think that Hillary, or Obama, or Kerry/Edwards/Gore/Biden would have unleashed this hell on the country and the world? They leave a lot to be desired, but there’s no way they would have.</p> <p>The patient is in critical condition, dying on the table! We need to win one and stop the bleeding! </p> <p>I liked the text-message theatre… silly as it was… at least McCain couldn’t get any oxygen for what, 3 days? The media that covered the inanity of covering a closed door at Bayh’s house is the same media that covered a 5.5 earthquake in California like it was a major disaster! I don’t see what we can do about the media, except continue to call out it’s stupidity and then watch it die, hopefully. </p> <p>The Game is what it is. We need to freaking WIN.</p>

So how is everyone feeling about Obama this November after the VP selection? With some of the things he has said and done since defeating Hillary I’m still not convinced he’s going to be much different if elected.

I’m feeling pretty good. i like the pick.

Does anyone here really think that Hillary, or Obama, or Kerry/Edwards/Gore/Biden would have unleashed this hell on the country and the world? They leave a lot to be desired, but there’s no way they would have.

The patient is in critical condition, dying on the table! We need to win one and stop the bleeding!

I liked the text-message theatre… silly as it was… at least McCain couldn’t get any oxygen for what, 3 days? The media that covered the inanity of covering a closed door at Bayh’s house is the same media that covered a 5.5 earthquake in California like it was a major disaster! I don’t see what we can do about the media, except continue to call out it’s stupidity and then watch it die, hopefully.

The Game is what it is. We need to freaking WIN.

]]> By: MarieRoget http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96060 MarieRoget Sun, 24 Aug 2008 15:24:55 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96060 <p><em>So how is everyone feeling about Obama this November after the VP selection? With some of the things he has said and done since defeating Hillary I’m still not convinced he’s going to be much different if elected.</em></p> <p>Why, GCP, how ever can you make such a statement right before the week of the <strike>canonization</strike> <strike>deification</strike> convention?</p> <p>From David Horsey in this morning’s Seattle PI:<br /><a href="http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/horsey/viewbydate.asp?ID=1808" rel="nofollow">http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/.....sp?ID=1808</a></p> <p>(How am I feeling, personally? Despite Biden being aboard, very nervous about what Prez Obama might actually do/not attempt in the way of “change”)</p> So how is everyone feeling about Obama this November after the VP selection? With some of the things he has said and done since defeating Hillary I’m still not convinced he’s going to be much different if elected.

Why, GCP, how ever can you make such a statement right before the week of the canonization deification convention?

From David Horsey in this morning’s Seattle PI:
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/…..sp?ID=1808

(How am I feeling, personally? Despite Biden being aboard, very nervous about what Prez Obama might actually do/not attempt in the way of “change”)

]]> By: GulfCoastPirate http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96059 GulfCoastPirate Sun, 24 Aug 2008 14:31:34 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96059 <p>Thanks for the links. I had seen it previously but it is still quite enlightening. Let’s remember, the smirk is a man who ignored 9 - 11 warnings and mocked a death row inmate when she pleaded for her life. I’ll never be able to figure out how he got elected (not once but twice). There is a sickness in that man that must also be in that portion of the general population who elected him and the people of New Orleans paid the price.</p> <p>So how is everyone feeling about Obama this November after the VP selection? With some of the things he has said and done since defeating Hillary I’m still not convinced he’s going to be much different if elected.</p> Thanks for the links. I had seen it previously but it is still quite enlightening. Let’s remember, the smirk is a man who ignored 9 – 11 warnings and mocked a death row inmate when she pleaded for her life. I’ll never be able to figure out how he got elected (not once but twice). There is a sickness in that man that must also be in that portion of the general population who elected him and the people of New Orleans paid the price.

So how is everyone feeling about Obama this November after the VP selection? With some of the things he has said and done since defeating Hillary I’m still not convinced he’s going to be much different if elected.

]]> By: plunger http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96058 plunger Sun, 24 Aug 2008 14:26:34 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96058 <p>“No one could have foreseen…”<br /> KATRINA DEBACLE - Bush Defends Chertoff…<br /> Here is what the Voice of America was saying:</p> <p>After Hurricane Katrina, President Bush and Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said no one could have expected levees, or floodwalls, to fail in New Orleans.</p> <blockquote><p>“I don’t think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees,” President Bush said.</p> <p>“That perfect storm of combination of catastrophes exceeded the foresight of the planners and maybe anybody’s foresight,” said Mr. Chertoff.</p></blockquote> <p>However, Mr. Chertoff’s own planners apparently had such foresight because Homeland Security officials sent an e-mail to the White House warning about levee failure five hours before Katrina made landfall on August 29th.</p> <p>Domsetic Spying Debacle - Chertoff Defends Bush…NSA data mining is legal, necessary, Chertoff says</p> <p>Editorial by Morton Kondracke</p> <blockquote><p>“I think it’s important to point out,” Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff told me in an interview, “that there’s no evidence that this is a program designed to achieve political ends or do something nefarious.”</p></blockquote> <p>He was talking about the National Security Agency’s warrantless “domestic spying” program, and I couldn’t agree with him more. Despite the alarms sounded by the American Civil Liberties Union, former Vice President Al Gore and various members of Congress, “there hasn’t even been a hint” that the program is targeted at domestic dissidents or innocent bystanders, Chertoff said. It’s designed to find and stop terrorists.</p> <blockquote><p>“If you go back to the post-Sept. 11 analysis and the 9/11 Commission, the whole message was that we were inadequately sensitive to the need to identify the dots and connect them,” he said.</p></blockquote> <p>FOLLOW THE BUSH/CHERTOFF PROTECTION RACKET…</p> <p>Speaking of connecting the 9/11 dots…guess who was in charge of retracing the money trail on “Operation Greenquest?” Well, that would be Michael Chertoff…</p> <p><a href="http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-01-11-chertoff-side_x.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.usatoday.com/news/w.....side_x.htm</a></p> <p>Now, tell me the one again about why Bush couldn’t fire Chertoff? Got blackmail?</p> “No one could have foreseen…”
KATRINA DEBACLE – Bush Defends Chertoff…
Here is what the Voice of America was saying:

After Hurricane Katrina, President Bush and Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said no one could have expected levees, or floodwalls, to fail in New Orleans.

“I don’t think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees,” President Bush said.

“That perfect storm of combination of catastrophes exceeded the foresight of the planners and maybe anybody’s foresight,” said Mr. Chertoff.

However, Mr. Chertoff’s own planners apparently had such foresight because Homeland Security officials sent an e-mail to the White House warning about levee failure five hours before Katrina made landfall on August 29th.

Domsetic Spying Debacle – Chertoff Defends Bush…NSA data mining is legal, necessary, Chertoff says

Editorial by Morton Kondracke

“I think it’s important to point out,” Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff told me in an interview, “that there’s no evidence that this is a program designed to achieve political ends or do something nefarious.”

He was talking about the National Security Agency’s warrantless “domestic spying” program, and I couldn’t agree with him more. Despite the alarms sounded by the American Civil Liberties Union, former Vice President Al Gore and various members of Congress, “there hasn’t even been a hint” that the program is targeted at domestic dissidents or innocent bystanders, Chertoff said. It’s designed to find and stop terrorists.

“If you go back to the post-Sept. 11 analysis and the 9/11 Commission, the whole message was that we were inadequately sensitive to the need to identify the dots and connect them,” he said.

FOLLOW THE BUSH/CHERTOFF PROTECTION RACKET…

Speaking of connecting the 9/11 dots…guess who was in charge of retracing the money trail on “Operation Greenquest?” Well, that would be Michael Chertoff…

http://www.usatoday.com/news/w…..side_x.htm

Now, tell me the one again about why Bush couldn’t fire Chertoff? Got blackmail?

]]> By: plunger http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96057 plunger Sun, 24 Aug 2008 14:17:52 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/23/when-the-levee-breaks/#comment-96057 <p>The only time we’ve EVER seen Bush take the blame for anything that has ever gone wrong, is when he stepped out in front of Chertoff to take the blame for every single one of Chertoff’s own failures. Chertoff absolutely deserved to be fired for his performance, unless of course the goal was to depopulate New Orleans.</p> <p>What does Occam’s Razor tell you about the way that Chertoff managed the preparation and aftermath of Katrina, and the fact that he still holds his job? Who is Chertoff, really? Who does he work for, really?</p> The only time we’ve EVER seen Bush take the blame for anything that has ever gone wrong, is when he stepped out in front of Chertoff to take the blame for every single one of Chertoff’s own failures. Chertoff absolutely deserved to be fired for his performance, unless of course the goal was to depopulate New Orleans.

What does Occam’s Razor tell you about the way that Chertoff managed the preparation and aftermath of Katrina, and the fact that he still holds his job? Who is Chertoff, really? Who does he work for, really?

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