<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: FISA Redux: The Slippery Slope Becomes A Mine Shaft</title>
	<atom:link href="http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/</link>
	<description></description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 24 Nov 2009 04:46:47 -0600</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: PraedorAtrebates</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95387</link>
		<dc:creator>PraedorAtrebates</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:42:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95387</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I would like to suggest that anyone undertaking peace march planning or a political protest of some kind get everyone involved to agree to screen all attendees to meetings as to whether they are police/FBI agents of some kind…or wired.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;There are also relatively cheap bug detectors available online that one could use to screen all people coming into a gathering:  eliminate informants and/or police or FBI agents who may be wired at the start.  Their fascist task should be made as difficult as possible on principle.  In addition, it is a good idea to screen attendees because more often than not, the “informants” or undercover types are among the first to agitate for violent or otherwise criminal action.  Eliminate these bastards from the start.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would like to suggest that anyone undertaking peace march planning or a political protest of some kind get everyone involved to agree to screen all attendees to meetings as to whether they are police/FBI agents of some kind…or wired.  </p>
<p>There are also relatively cheap bug detectors available online that one could use to screen all people coming into a gathering:  eliminate informants and/or police or FBI agents who may be wired at the start.  Their fascist task should be made as difficult as possible on principle.  In addition, it is a good idea to screen attendees because more often than not, the “informants” or undercover types are among the first to agitate for violent or otherwise criminal action.  Eliminate these bastards from the start.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: PraedorAtrebates</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95386</link>
		<dc:creator>PraedorAtrebates</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 17:34:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95386</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I most certainly haven’t gotten over this shit and I will NEVER get over it.  I am so NOT over it that I refuse to vote for Obama in the Fall.  I will be casting a vote for Bob Barr, not because I like his social positions (as a GOPer) but because he is heading a party, assuredly nutty in many ways, that flat-out rejects ANY of these police state tactics and powers.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Obama can go to hell - and that is essentially what I say every time some Obamabot OR Democrat fundraiser calls seeking money.  NO NO NO!  No money, no vote.  FISA and PAA and Iraq combine to make them beyond my boundaries for voting.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I most certainly haven’t gotten over this shit and I will NEVER get over it.  I am so NOT over it that I refuse to vote for Obama in the Fall.  I will be casting a vote for Bob Barr, not because I like his social positions (as a GOPer) but because he is heading a party, assuredly nutty in many ways, that flat-out rejects ANY of these police state tactics and powers.  </p>
<p>Obama can go to hell &#8211; and that is essentially what I say every time some Obamabot OR Democrat fundraiser calls seeking money.  NO NO NO!  No money, no vote.  FISA and PAA and Iraq combine to make them beyond my boundaries for voting.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95286</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Aug 2008 03:10:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95286</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;On domestic spying: I think it’s clear from the Saddleback Forum that McCain is at minimum portraying himself as an extremist in the tradition of Barry Goldwater (”extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice”). So, asking him how to balance civil rights like privacy with national defense of human lives will be as difficult for him as defining what ‘rich’ is.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;He’ll nearly always pick a stark black &amp; white view of things and pick one thing to emphasize.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;He picks “Life” over Privacy with regard to abortion.&lt;br /&gt;
He picks national defense over health care reform.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Name it and he picks the Right-Wing policy prescription instead of finding any shade of gray to ensure all Rights are supported.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Don’t count on McCain to defend your voting rights if he thinks national security demands we install a totalitarian style of government.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Don’t count on McCain to defend your right to unionize if he thinks it will interfere with the “right” of a corporation to treat you like dirt.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Don’t count on McCain to defend your right to anything. He has to listen to lobbyists for the Haves and the Have-More Rich and you’re not on his speed-dial.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On domestic spying: I think it’s clear from the Saddleback Forum that McCain is at minimum portraying himself as an extremist in the tradition of Barry Goldwater (”extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice”). So, asking him how to balance civil rights like privacy with national defense of human lives will be as difficult for him as defining what ‘rich’ is.</p>
<p>He’ll nearly always pick a stark black &amp; white view of things and pick one thing to emphasize.</p>
<p>He picks “Life” over Privacy with regard to abortion.<br />
He picks national defense over health care reform.</p>
<p>Name it and he picks the Right-Wing policy prescription instead of finding any shade of gray to ensure all Rights are supported.</p>
<p>Don’t count on McCain to defend your voting rights if he thinks national security demands we install a totalitarian style of government.</p>
<p>Don’t count on McCain to defend your right to unionize if he thinks it will interfere with the “right” of a corporation to treat you like dirt.</p>
<p>Don’t count on McCain to defend your right to anything. He has to listen to lobbyists for the Haves and the Have-More Rich and you’re not on his speed-dial.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: bmaz</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95258</link>
		<dc:creator>bmaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 18:20:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95258</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;And MadDog and everybody else - This, psychologists/psychiatrists revolt, is an important point, and I had already promised Kirk Murphy that I would get into it in depth.  Kirk practices in the field and he got very early notice on some of this a couple of nights ago.  I think there will be some other pretty good info from another source that you will like too.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;However, I have to finish a late, and much needed, breakfast and then run over to the Apple store.  Today is the big day.  iPhone.  My heart beats and palms sweat with anticipation.  40 minutes till &lt;strike&gt;Wapner&lt;/strike&gt; the store opens.   &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So probably late afternoon/early evening I will have the psych torture material ready.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And MadDog and everybody else &#8211; This, psychologists/psychiatrists revolt, is an important point, and I had already promised Kirk Murphy that I would get into it in depth.  Kirk practices in the field and he got very early notice on some of this a couple of nights ago.  I think there will be some other pretty good info from another source that you will like too.</p>
<p>However, I have to finish a late, and much needed, breakfast and then run over to the Apple store.  Today is the big day.  iPhone.  My heart beats and palms sweat with anticipation.  40 minutes till <strike>Wapner</strike> the store opens.   </p>
<p>So probably late afternoon/early evening I will have the psych torture material ready.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: bmaz</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95256</link>
		<dc:creator>bmaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 17:58:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95256</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;NEW POST ALERT&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/17/the-bates-decision-a-question-unasked-and-unanswered/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The Bates Decision: A Question Unasked And Unanswered&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>NEW POST ALERT</p>
<p><a href="http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/17/the-bates-decision-a-question-unasked-and-unanswered/" rel="nofollow">The Bates Decision: A Question Unasked And Unanswered</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: wavpeac</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95255</link>
		<dc:creator>wavpeac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 17:41:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95255</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I don’t know how any psychologist could rationalize using their expertise to aid and abet the violation of geneva conventions. A teenager!! &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Today,we know for a fact that the adolescent brain and developement of the frontal lobe, the lobe responsible for cognitive functions and reasoning does not fully develope until the age of about 22,23 years old.  How can any doctor participate in an activity that puts this normal developement at risk. We know what trauma does to the brain. Is there any way that it could be argued that a teen being held as an enemy combatant is NOT being traumatized. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Screw it…I am a bleeding heart liberal, I just don’t think we can get to peace by using violence and fear.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don’t know how any psychologist could rationalize using their expertise to aid and abet the violation of geneva conventions. A teenager!! </p>
<p>Today,we know for a fact that the adolescent brain and developement of the frontal lobe, the lobe responsible for cognitive functions and reasoning does not fully develope until the age of about 22,23 years old.  How can any doctor participate in an activity that puts this normal developement at risk. We know what trauma does to the brain. Is there any way that it could be argued that a teen being held as an enemy combatant is NOT being traumatized. </p>
<p>Screw it…I am a bleeding heart liberal, I just don’t think we can get to peace by using violence and fear.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: bmaz</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95254</link>
		<dc:creator>bmaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 16:42:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95254</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Oh, and I cannot possibly describe to you just exactly how much my head hurts right now.  I am getting too old to have as much fun as I did last night.  Ouch.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, and I cannot possibly describe to you just exactly how much my head hurts right now.  I am getting too old to have as much fun as I did last night.  Ouch.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: bmaz</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95253</link>
		<dc:creator>bmaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 16:36:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95253</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Hi folks.  Just wanted to check in briefly.  Last night was a huge 50th birthday party  for one of our best friends.  Very long night.  I will be back in a bit, but wanted to say good morning.  The discussion you have been having here is exactly what a lot of people i have been talking to are having (well, yours is a little more articulate, but same basic conversation).  The fact alone that it is generating this conversation may be the real value of last night’s Rick Warren fest. So carry on.  And Pete, thank you.  See how much better it is when you talk to people and have them engage instead of talking at them?  Very good.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi folks.  Just wanted to check in briefly.  Last night was a huge 50th birthday party  for one of our best friends.  Very long night.  I will be back in a bit, but wanted to say good morning.  The discussion you have been having here is exactly what a lot of people i have been talking to are having (well, yours is a little more articulate, but same basic conversation).  The fact alone that it is generating this conversation may be the real value of last night’s Rick Warren fest. So carry on.  And Pete, thank you.  See how much better it is when you talk to people and have them engage instead of talking at them?  Very good.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: MadDog</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95252</link>
		<dc:creator>MadDog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 16:21:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95252</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;OT from the NYT - &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/16/washington/16psych.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Psychologists Clash on Aiding Interrogations&lt;/a&gt;:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;…In court documents filed Thursday, lawyers for the Guantánamo detainee Mohammed Jawad asserted that a psychologist’s report helped land Mr. Jawad, a teenager at the time, in a segregation cell, where he became increasingly desperate. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;According to the documents, the psychologist, whose name has not been released, completed an assessment of Mr. Jawad after he was seen talking to a poster on his cell wall. Shortly thereafter, in September 2003, he was isolated from other detainees, and many of his requests to see an interrogator were ignored. He later attempted suicide, according to the filing, which asks that the case be dismissed on the ground of abusive treatment. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The Guantánamo court is reviewing the case. Military lawyers have denied that Mr. Jawad suffered any mental health problems from his interrogation. On Thursday, the psychologist in the case invoked Article 31 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice, the military’s equivalent of the Fifth Amendment. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;“This is what it’s come to,” said Steven Reisner, an assistant clinical professor at the New York University School of Medicine and a leading candidate for the presidency of the psychological association. “We have psychologists taking the Fifth.”&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OT from the NYT &#8211; <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/16/washington/16psych.html" rel="nofollow">Psychologists Clash on Aiding Interrogations</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>…In court documents filed Thursday, lawyers for the Guantánamo detainee Mohammed Jawad asserted that a psychologist’s report helped land Mr. Jawad, a teenager at the time, in a segregation cell, where he became increasingly desperate. </p>
<p>According to the documents, the psychologist, whose name has not been released, completed an assessment of Mr. Jawad after he was seen talking to a poster on his cell wall. Shortly thereafter, in September 2003, he was isolated from other detainees, and many of his requests to see an interrogator were ignored. He later attempted suicide, according to the filing, which asks that the case be dismissed on the ground of abusive treatment. </p>
<p>The Guantánamo court is reviewing the case. Military lawyers have denied that Mr. Jawad suffered any mental health problems from his interrogation. On Thursday, the psychologist in the case invoked Article 31 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice, the military’s equivalent of the Fifth Amendment. </p>
<p>“This is what it’s come to,” said Steven Reisner, an assistant clinical professor at the New York University School of Medicine and a leading candidate for the presidency of the psychological association. “We have psychologists taking the Fifth.”</p>
</blockquote>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: skdadl</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/comment-page-2/#comment-95251</link>
		<dc:creator>skdadl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Aug 2008 15:29:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/08/16/fisa-redux-the-slippery-slope-becomes-a-mine-shaft/#comment-95251</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Well, probably not if they want to be PM — so far.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, probably not if they want to be PM — so far.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
