Joe Persichini, the Assistant Director of the DC FBI Field Office said of Bruce Ivins yesterday, "It appears, based on the evidence, that he was acting alone."
Yet he and DC US Attorney Jeff Taylor seem painfully aware that their evidence doesn't add up to a compelling case. In particular, Taylor and Persichini dodged and weaved whenever asked about any hard evidence that tied Bruce Ivins to the mailing--rather than just the production--of the anthrax.
For example, Taylor made an incredibly misleading statement to suggest that the envelopes used in the attack were only available in Frederick Maryland. He claimed that, "based on the analysis, we were able to conclude that the envelopes used in the mailings were very likely sold in a post office in the Frederick, MD post office in 2001." He continued to say that Ivins maintained a PO Box "at the post office from which these pre-franked envelopes were sold."
But the truth is that Frederick Maryland is just one of hundreds of post offices at which those envelopes would have been available:
Subsequent to the attacks, an effort was made to collect all such envelopes for possible forensic examination, including the identification of defects that occur during the envelope manufacturing process. As a result of this collection, envelopes with printing defects identical to printing defects identified on the envelopes utilized in the anthrax attacks during the fall of 2001 were collected fiom the Fairfax Main post office in Fairfax, Virginia and the Cumberland and Elkton post offices in Maryland. The Fairfax Main, Cumberland, Maryland, and Elkton, Maryland post offices are supplied by the Dulles Stamp Distribution Office (SDO), located in Dulles, Virginia. The Dulles SDO distributed "federal eagle" envelopes to post offices throughout Maryland and Virginia. Given that the printing defects identified on the envelopes used in the attacks are transient, thereby being present on only a small population of the federal eagle envelopes produced, and that envelopes with identical printing defects to those identified on the envelopes used in the attacks were recovered fiom post offices serviced by the Dulles SDO, it is reasonable to conclude that the federal eagle envelopes utilized in the attacks were purchased from a post office in Maryland or Virginia. [my emphasis]
In other words, Taylor suggests, inaccurately, that Ivins' post office was the only one where those envelopes were available, rather than one of many post offices.
Then, when Persichini was asked about whether there was any hard evidence found in the searches of Ivins' car and home, Persichini dodged by directing reporters back to the documents--documents which say nothing about such hard evidence.
QUESTION: A question for Mr. Persichini. You build -- this is obviously, at this point, a circumstantial case. You build a strong circumstantial case. What direct evidence do you have? For instance, do you have any tape that was used on the envelope that was recovered from his home? Do you have any other -- any other evidence that clearly would link him? For instance, in the affidavit, it mentions that people of this sort often keep souvenirs. Did you find anything like that at his home?
MR. PERSICHINI: Well first, I would refer back to the documents, because that’s the purpose of our press conference today, to provide you the documents and the information pertained in the documents. As it relates to admitting evidence into it, I’m going to refer back to Jeff. But again, we’re looking at the document itself and the purpose of our release and providing this information to the families. That’s first and foremost for us. So I won’t discuss the actuality of evidence, then.
Another reporter asks whether Ivins' handwriting or hair matches up with the evidence found (note, the official transcript is inaccurate here; I've made corrections in brackets).
QUESTION: Jeff, did you find any handwriting samples or hair samples that would have matched Dr. Ivins to the envelopes where the hair samples were found in the mailbox?
MR. [PERSICHINI]: We did not find any handwriting analysis or hair samples in the mailbox. So there were no facts and circumstances of that part. [Persichini walks away from the podium.]
QUESTION: You didn't take handwriting samples from Dr. Ivins? MR. TAYLOR: We examined handwriting samples but then there was no comparison made or a specific identification of the handwriting. It appears that when the analysts would look at it, that there was an attempt to disguise the handwriting. So it was unable to make a comparison.
With respect to handwriting samples, we did have indications from individuals with whom we spoke that there appeared to be some similarities in handwriting that were apparent. That said, we did not have a scientifically valid conclusion that we thought would lead us to be able to admit that in evidence.
Persichini, in particular, doesn't seem to want to talk about the handwriting samples--and the lack of any real evidence matching Ivins' handwriting to that used on the envelopes. Furthermore, he outright lies when he says there were no hair samples taken from the mailbox.
The collection box on Nassau Street was identified through forensic biological swabbing of every U.S. Postal Service drop box that collects mail to be processed at the Hamilton facility. Further forensic examination of the contaminated mailbox recovered a number of Caucasian human hairs fiom inside the box, which are suitable for comparison.
Granted, there's no reason to think that the Caucasion hair in the Nassau Street box had anything to do with the anthrax case--but wouldn't it be more honest to say that?
In short, while Taylor talked a lot about the possibility of making an entirely circumstantial case and claimed repeatedly that, had they tried this, they would have been able to prove beyond reasonable doubt that Bruce Ivins was "acting alone," they tried to dodge admitting that while they have fairly strong evidence tying Ivins to the anthrax used in the case, their evidence goes to shit as soon as you try to prove that Ivins then took that anthrax and mailed it to reporters and senators.
Login Here
Share This
Spotlight
No case. How sad!
As I wrote in the post downstairs:
And lo and behold we have the grassy knoll.
I just watched the press conference at C-SPAN — it’s up right now on the main page. Forgive me, but I don’t know how to save the link from the video — thanks to anyone who can do that.
Taylor’s face does turn red. And Persichini is quite the accomplished PR speaker, isn’t he.
*pedantry alert to Jeffrey Taylor re suspicious/suspect* You don’t mean his behaviour was suspicious; you mean it was suspect, or you viewed it as suspect. If I am suspicious of you, then I am suspicious and you are suspect. */pedantry alert*
This “case” is so full of shit that it is literally oozing brown; Ivins may or may not be guilty, but the case set out to date couldn’t prove anything. Many will ask “but would it stand up to cross-examination”? What a joke. Of course not; the case can’t even stand up for a whole 24 hours of scrutiny by some DFHs. If the government needed to convict Ivins, having him be dead was their one and only hope if this is the best they got. And anybody who thinks for one split second that this isn’t the best evidence set they could trot out, you are nuts. They out spies when they need to; they would burn whatever and whoever they needed to to shut this down once and for all. This IS what they got, and it ain’t real good.
Was the whole press conference like this??
What a bummer that they didn’t find any handwriting analysis in the mailbox — I guess sometimes it’s tough to find those facts and circumstances.
Is this intentional “baffle-’em-with-bullshit” or has this guy’s brain atrophied from too many years of cop-speak?
EPU’d on previous thread:
Ru-roh. Has anyone else noticed the problem inherent in the fact that Ivins went off the Special Immunization Program in spring, 2001 and didn’t go back on it until September 7? Yet,the after-hours data on access to the “hot suite” show lots of time in August, when he would have been most at risk from being off the program. Wouldn’t they have taken away his access when he went off the program? More details in a post I just put up; click my name.
This is all they’ve got, & we were told yesterday we can stuff it. MSM is willing to move along; watch it move along w/amazing rapidity unless there are hugeass hearings/investigation.
DOJ/FBI pushing this one out of the limelight hard enough to break a wrist.
that the handwriting samples used the English Alphabet, which Dr. Ivins has also been known to use ?
so they had the tail wagging the dog;
IF this suspect were the perpetrator THEN he likely bought the envelope in this venue, SINCE we want to claim he IS the suspect we can THEREFORE claim he LIKELY bought the envelope at precisely the place he needs to have bought it to be the suspect in the first place
or something equally convoluted
The reporters who questioned Taylor and Joe Persichini were simply inane. They had no case any self-respecting AUSA or USA would take to a grand jury and that’s saying they had no credible physical evidence whatsoever.
I’ve hit several areas where they have no credible evidence and so have others.
The cluck clucking media is now reduced to going to family members of the anthrax victims and asking them their impressions of the evidence. That’s a far cry from the legal team that would have defended Dr. Ivins.
Taylor is fulfilling the role of the desultory Bush aparichick that he is. Taylor did the same thing when he was on Orin Hatch’s (no litigation experience in a federal courtroom Hatch but used to talk as if he had been Mr. federal litigator when chairman of SJC).
From the wiki wik:
Those envelops could have been bought in scores if not hundreds of places. The hair they have is no more help than the pubic hair of the FBI and it might has well/could have been for all we know.
Other than harassing Ivins’ family and showing how stupid that US Attorneys in the Bush administration and the FBI in the Bush administration has become, and reminding us of what a totally inept moron Mike Chertoff is as Director of DHS since there is no anthrax plan and they have stockpiled 60 million essentially worthless vaccines when applied to defending the American people against pulmonary anthrax at the cost and waste of billions of dollars, and showing that the Bush administration can marshall MD’s who have no concept of what it takes to defend against an acute anthrax attack, I’m not sure what all the fanfare has been about.
I guess you could mark it as the concecration of the United States as a Bannana Republic and an insult to attorneys everywhere that the DOJ and FBI have deteriorated into pure shit.
Yeah, I was wondering about that–but I don’t know how long the evidence is good for. But they’ve got a spike starting in August, before he was back on the vaccine, at a time when we know he was working on the vaccine’s efficacy. What’s up there?
from the email you quote:
“…I don’t know what will happen to the research programs and hot suite work until we get a new lot….”
While its making alibis for Ivins which - apparently - he didn’t make for himself, if he was concerned that the supply of vaccine was exhausted he’d be rushing to complete work that had languished for months since he was now re-authorized, but subject to the finite efficacy of the last dosing.
emptywheel:
Someone else might have addressed this, but you said Ivins’ comment about anthrax and sarin suggested contact with intelligence.
However, that’s something I vaguely recall hearing on tv, and commenter “Anonymous” at Nass’s site confirms this:
Jeebus. Nice catch.
Probably a futile pursuit, but the Woodrow Wilson School has to be a nest of neocons.
And Woodrow Wilson liked faked casus belli (that’s the plural!).
LSD leaves a metallic taste in the user’s mouth:
Among the federal documents are excerpts from Ivins’ e-mails to a friend detailing his battles with mental illness. They include parts of an August 2000 email about “one of [his] worst nights in months” and his “paranoid, delusional thoughts.”
“I wish I could control the thoughts in my mind,” the e-mail read, according to a federal affidavit. “It’s hard enough sometimes controlling my behavior. When I’m being eaten alive inside, I always try to put on a good front at work and at home, so I don’t spread the pestilence.”
“Occasionally I get this tingling that goes down both arms,” read an e-mail sent by Ivins on April 3, 2000. “At the same time I get dizzy and get this unidentifiable ‘metallic’ taste in my mouth. (I’m not trying to be funny, [redacted] … It actually scares me a bit.) Other times it’s like I’m not only sitting at my desk doing work, I’m also a few feet away watching me do it. There’s nothing like living in both the first person singular AND the third person singular!”
“Remember when I told you about the ‘metallic’ taste in my mouth that I got periodically? It’s when I get these ‘paranoid’ episodes … Ominously, a lot of the feelings of isolation — and desolation — that I went through before college are returning. I don’t want to relive those years again.”
SEE FULL POSTING AND LINKS AT #36 on prior TIMELINE thread
Paranoid episodes, each concurrent with Metallic Taste = LSD
The AVA was the material he was getting from BioPort to test. His concern there was that BioPort material was continually failing tests that would make it unfit for use; he was starting to become concerned that the group would have no approved material to work with on their main project. That is separate from the vaccines he was taking personally to make it safe for him to enter the hot suite. I just don’t see how he would have authorization to enter the hot suite if he was off the vaccines for several months. The reporting is a bit sketchy on what the vaccination program was, but it appears that they got at least three shots a year, if not more. Of course, it also is not clear from his email what he meant by going off the program. If spring 2001 was when he first skipped a shot that was due, then by August there is no way he should have been in the hot suite.
The guys at the press conference may not have been lying about this; they may just be dummies who didn’t grasp the limited, but sensible, inference made in the case document: it narrowed down the laboratories in range of the post offices that sold the envelopes. It made no claim which post office.
Or the drugs he was prescribed.
Others have said it, but I agree. The perspective on this case from Dr. Nass is compelling.
http://anthraxvaccine.blogspot.com/
1. More than 100 people had access to the anthrax strain involved.
2. The envelopes could have been purchased by anyone anywhere in Virginia or Maryland.
3. This is one of the most complex, expensive and longest-lasting cases in FBI history. It still can’t place Ivins or an identified accomplice at the scene in Princeton where the letters were posted.
4. Ivins worked extra hours at his lab shortly after 9/11. How many federal employees anywhere in government could truthfully say the opposite?
5. The FBI attempted to pay Ivins’ son $2.5 million if he said his dad did it. Apart from the hoped for sound bite, which Ivins’ son never gave them, where’s the first-hand knowledge that that might be true?
6. As EW’s thread title suggests, the FBI has settled on, “the crazy guy did it alone” meme. The ability to evade for seven years the most resource rich man hunt in decades, if not ever, suggests not craziness, but high-order ability to plan, execute and exercise self-restraint.
7. The sorority angle is just that, an angle; it’s not been shown relevant to the case, except to impugn Ivins’ credibility. Ditto the strange episode with Ms. Duley. Even if true, which is questionable, its collateral in that it doesn’t show Ivins made the materials or sent the letters. And the FBI insists “there was no conspiracy”. Suggesting the latter, of course, would imply more widespread problems and incite legitimate fears. It would also invite inquiry where none is wanted. Which brings us to the last item.
8. Cui bono? Other than “the crazy guy obsessed” with a sorority (always a good meme for testosterone-toxic Washington), who else had a financial or political reason to have sent the letters? Who “won” after these attacks, which saw the passage of the Patriot Act, the Iraq war, the birth of a $50 billion “bioterrorism” industry, and the revival of a moribund anthrax vaccine program, one of whose chief beneficiaries was Bioport. Its CEO bought the company in 1998 for $3 million down, with a US Army guarantee in hand. The day after Ivins was admitted to hospital and the day after he died, the CEO sold shares worth $200 million. How and on what basis were these other candidates removed from consideration?
The last two item draw attention to the elephant in the living room. Missing from the investigation so far is a discussion about the government-run and government-backed bio-weapons and bio-terrorism industries, their origins, sources of wealth and political backing and their obvious management flaws, which led to the misuse of woefully dangerous materials.
As EW hails from the land of automotive, that brings to mind a basic quality process analogy about this investigation. Has the FBI been attempting to fix the paint bubbles on a single hood, or ought it to be looking at the paint line that leaves bubbles on lots of hoods? Congress, at least, and the next administration, should focus on the latter.
Now I’m having flashbacks to that footage of those AQ guys playing leapfrog.
This post says immunizations would have been bi-yearly at most, so if he was taken off in the spring, the vaccine woudl still have residual efficacy.
Woodrow Wilson’s head, Anne-Marie Slaughter, I believe, is a right wing Democrat and possibly a closet neocon, but the School as a whole has a diversity of views. Johns Hopkins SAIS is regarded as farther right. Dartmouth is no liberal’s favorite, certainly not its news rag, Brown and Cornell are farther left, but hey, let’s throw in Harvard, Columbia, Penn and Yale and poison the ivy.
Thanks. I’ve also left a question at Dr. Nass’s blog asking if she can help us to understand when he would have been denied access because of going off the program.
The FBI and USA had this evidence in front of a grand jury, right? Did the Grand Jury decide to indict or not indict, or were they still deliberating? I don’t remember reading on the front page of every newspaper:
When Ivans died, someone decided they had an opportunity. Was that a bottom up or top down internal decision? Did Mueller want to dump the case, declare guilt by innuendo and be done with it or did Mukasey, or was it the White House political officer now in charge of USA Attorney prosecuting decisions?
Taylor was making a case yesterday in front of a national television audience that he was embarrassed to make. He was embarrassed professionally. As to who drove the decision, we just done know.
Cui Bono?
Motive?
The list is longer than my arm, and Ivins is nowhere to be found on it.
Spell SAIC backwards…
CIA’s
SAIC was commissioned by G. W. Bush in 2002 to construct a replica of a mobile WMD laboratory of the sort used by Saddam. This mock up, supposedly destined to be used to train teams searching for WMDs in Iraq, was designed by Stephen Hatfill, the WMD expert now being harangued into isolation and thus silence by Bush’s FBI. Last spring, the Bush administration handed SAIC some of the biggest defense contract plums to be had -a billion-dollar chunk of the NexGen business and an unbelievably porky 10-year contract worth over $600 million.”
http://www.mail-archive.com/ct…..07176.html
http://www.warprofiteers.com/article.php?id=7892
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S…..orporation
http://www.whatreallyhappened&.....spect.html
Wonders never cease. Some parts of the gov’t can’t keep track of nuclear weapons, but others can trace envelopes with transient printing defects to a post office in Maryland. Wow. I’m impressed.
But Woodrow Wilson is at Princeton.
So is Bernard Lewis.
They didn’t trace it to “a post office”. They traced it to hundreds of post offices within range of a single laboratory.
They did not indict and in different comments to the media the FBI team said directly that they didn’t have enough evidence to indict. They did what DOJ is best doing.
DOJ you will find can be very very aggressive until they have significant oposition. They are much more careful when they think about taking on a large corporation.
They have their pressure points and can be called on their bullshit but it is not made easy.
They are in their element in amassing the government’s considerable but incompetent resources to pick on the little guy. Their preferred opponent, like most bullys is a dead oponent that they can pick on after his death.
A dead opponent offers the type of resistance or challenge they prefer and that is commensurate with their abilities.
DOJ lawyers are best equipped to litigate against dead people and to deal with the motions of dead people, and the challenges to their interpretations of the Federal Rules of Evidence by dead people.
It is as if in law school, Jeff Taylor was taught that he was being trained to litiate against dead lawyers and dead defendants because that best represents his ability.
Jeff Taylor by the way has next to no trial experience in a federal courtroom like his mentor Orin Hatch. He has no idea of what a real case needs to fly in a real courtroom.
Although any idiot can inhdict any ham sandwhich in a federal grand jury, and it is a completely selective dog and pony show presented by and large to people who have little legal training unless a lawyer happens to be on the grand jury, I don’t know with the lack of evidence that was presented yesterday (unless they have considerably more) if they could have secured an indictment.
It’s exactly as Bmaz has said. Dr. Ivins might be guilty or might be one of the people who is guilty, but you’d never be able to extrapolate it from what was presented. Hundreds of competent trial lawyers could have a field day with this case. I believe they have more information, but have no idea what the quality of it is.
There is really no bar that they have to meet. The media is largely worthless and they will move on. Except for people like Gerald not 7th Circuit Judge Richard Posner who has been rendered cowed and compliant by 911, (who probably thinks the evidence is fine they haven’t offered a peep as to critical analysis. I’m sure Dan Abrams had some problems with this, probably similar to Bmaz’ assessment, but I didn’t see his show last night and he probably will continue to have problems with it.
The more I hear about this case, the more I think it is highly plausible that Ivins was a cutout for/framed by a foreign group of terrorists who played the FBI like a grand piano. Or he was a cutout/framed by some one or some other group.
That’s what made me think of it.
I have a problem, though: judging by Miller’s squeamishness about getting real anthrax, I’m hesitant to believe one of them would have the bravery to handle a letter.
What bmaz said.
Mrs. Dr. Peterr is a research scientist (not anthrax, not DC), and as we were listening to the TV reporters breathlessly and ominously announcing that Ivins had “worked late and unusual hours in the lab,” she burst out laughing. “Who the hell *doesn’t*? It’s the rule, not the exception.”
To be specific, the grand jury was and is at this moment still in session on this case.
I agree with your conclusion that “…I just don’t see how he would have authorization to enter the hot suite if he was off the vaccines for several months. …”
However, another possible explanation:
“…The situation placed pressure on select staff members at USAMRIID, including Dr. Ivins, who were part of the Anthrax Potency Integrated Product Team (IPT). The purpose of the IPT was to assist in the resolution of technical issues that was plaguing Bioport’s production of approved lots of the vaccines.
In the weeks immediately prior to the attacks [my emphasis], Dr. Ivins became aware that an investigative journalist who worked for NBC News had submitted a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) requests on USAMRIID seeking detailed information from Dr. Ivins’s laboratory notebooks as they related to the AVA vaccine and the use of adjuvants. On August 28,2001, Dr. Ivins appeared angry about the request providing the following response in an e-mail: “Tell Matsumoto to kiss my ass. We’ve got better things to do than shine his shoes and pee on command. He’s gotten everything from me he will get.”…”
Responding to a FOIA is not trivial, though it does not explain why he’d be in the hot suite.
On a previous post, a commenter quoted what appears to be information about the lab SOP vis a vis immunization, that says workers had to be vaccinated or use appropriate personal protective equipment (PPE). So he had an alternative.
On previous threads, commenters were referring to Ivins’ lab as B-3, as if that were a room number. However, it is undoubtedly a reference to Biosafety Level 3, a level of biocontainment recommended for some types of work with some infectious agents. This classification comes from a set of guidelines issued by the CDC, “Biosafety in Microbiological and Biomedical Laboratories,” usually referred to as BMBL. Most labs using these kinds of agents follow BMBL. The edition of BMBL in effect at the time of the anthrax attacks was the 4th edition, and you can can see what it recommended for work with anthrax here.
Yep. Weird hours — who in research doesn’t do that? By the way, the weirdest thing of all about that to me is precisely 2 h 15 min overtime 3 nights in a row. I would be hard pressed to match such a feat of exact timing of nightly departures myself.
Can’t a guy have a little snark?
Yes. I did laugh at your comment.
Pressure wasn’t just coming from the upper levels of DOJ and the administration. Leahy turned the screws on Mukasey. While Mukasey can say something is an ongoing investigation as a dodge, in this case it may have been true. I’m not sure if the pressure from Leahy on a specific case was entirely appropriate. We might not have thought so if it had been a Repuplican bearing down on the A.G.
It seems that there is a similiarity of the Ivins episode with the ‘media dance’ that follows bush’s giving an order to impliment a decision. I’m thinking of the burst following the Plame outing, the burst on the need to remove SH, the burst to rewrite social security, the burst on the good of ‘ownership society’, the present burst on the need to drill off-shore. This burst on the anthrax case and its odd ineptitude seems another example of bush having ‘ordered’ the conclusion of the case.
I listened to a conversation between Ian Masters and Scott McClellan yesterday where Scottie talks about how bush is now going about cleaning up his (and cheney’s as they relate to him) messes before the end of his term so there will less chance for his facing accountability. It occurs to me that the anthrax case is one of those messes. Maybe that’s what we’re witnessing.
http://www.ianmasters.org/archives.html
Which letter(s) were mailed from Princeton, and when in relation to the other letters?
One would think that a review of surveillance videos from all post offices that could have sold the envelopes would have been undertaken; I hope there was such a review. The purchaser would have been likely to have been wearing gloves or to have received the envelopes bagged or packaged—so as to avoid leaving fingerprints on them—or to have purchased enough bundled envelopes (perhaps bound with a rubber band) to make feasible the handling of the bundle while leaving fingerprints on only the first and last envelopes, which could have been shredded.
Depends on what kind of research work you’re doing. If the protocol of your experiment says “add 5mls of item X to the solution, one hour later add 5mls of item Y, one hour after that add 5mls of item Z, and then let sit for twelve hours,” you could easily be in the lab in the evening for 2.25 hours running that experiment, so it is ready for you to analyze the next day.
Then suppose your first take on it doesn’t work. OK, stay late the second night and run it again, this time with 7.5mls instead of 5mls. Next morning, back in the lab, you see that take two washed out as well. OK, it’s a late night in the lab for a third night running. This time let’s try 10mls. Hey! What do you know: it worked. On to the next step in the research . . .
Three nights, the same 2.25 hours spent in the lab. It happens all the time, to researchers everywhere. The experiment rules the work schedule. Every time.
BTW, my point stands: there is an awful lot of supervision implied in being able to track a batch of envelopes, and a lot of knowledge of the distribution of errors throughout the presumably large production runs. What was this “transient error”, exactly? Was it a common ‘transient’ or a unique one? I mean, imagine that every so often the eagle gets printed 1/64th of an inch to the left because a new batch of blanks is put into the press. That kind of thing would happen periodically. (I get misaligned pages every time the paper in my printer gets low.) Did they put the blanks in backwards, so that the eagle came out upside down? OK; philately would have you believe that such errors are very rare indeed.
Who tracks such things? Who cares that much about envelopes from minute to minute?
Ain’t that the truth. And with bacterial work, you can’t exactly whip the little guys along to be ready right after lunch, either, I would imagine. And your overtime gets distributed entirely unpredicatably through the year, I also imagine — no significance to it being in August, say, instead of February.
To add to your suspicions: if my memory doesn’t deceive me, the tv media made public the assertions of these idiosyncracies in the envelopes in autumn 2001.
Is there some specific record of what he claimed to be doing these evenings?
Detrick would be REAL sticky about keeping lab books, I would guess.
As someone who made a similar point a few days ago, I feel compelled to offer two points on Leahy’s behalf, that legitimize such public pressure: he was an intended target, and he (and everyone in Congress) was being stonewalled by the FBI and DoJ about the status of the investigation.
The other aspect of the “pressure” is that it was only semi-public: it would have remained completely invisible to anyone not in the hearing room or watching on C-SPAN if not for Emptywheel. The words exchanged between Leahy and Mukasey went unreported in the media accounts of the hearing, which at most mentioned that Leahy inquired about the status of the investigation.
Hmmm….now let me think…immediately makes me wonder…who has a record of forging things like documents or handwriting….hmmmm….who might have given Ivins a mission or order to create a certain type of anthrax without an explanation of how it would be used (possibility)….oh yeah, and who would not want that handwriting to be analyzed….oh yeah, and who might turn on Ivins, making him really, really pissed off and distressed…. and who would be glad that he’s not a living witness, so that the case can be closed.
Grassy knoll indeed.
I’m missing your point; Princeton is an Ivy, hence, my snark, which was about casting a little too wide a net regarding who might have conspired in promoting these anthrax attacks.
Is it that you prefer the Nittany Lions to Princeton Tigers? Or is yours a broader attack on the military-intelligence-academic/think tank complex (”industrial” is now almost old hat) that enables this administration and its neocons? The latter, more general criticism, I think, has more weight than that the dons at Ivy campuses or international relations schools are all conspiring to commit bio-warfare.
Neil, I like Leahy a lot, but was he being stonewalled? Or was the case just not there? Leahy seemed to me like he was looking for a specific result.
Leahy is a victim of the crime within the contemplation of criminal investigation protocols; he has a right to ask questions and demand answers irrespective of his political position and/or status as a Senator.
Oh, now it’s my fault, eh?
A good point that I think bears repeating. The DOJ changed its story and admitted that the envelopes could have been purchased at any PO in two states, MD and VA. Half of the East Coast and mid-America, from NYC to Detroit to Cincinnati, Louisville, Charlotte and Columbia, lies within a day’s drive of one of those PO’s. So to say that proximity to one of them helps make the case against Ivins seems pretty weak.
All the letters were mailed from Princeton. The media letters were postmarked Sept. 18, and the Senate letters October 9.
Despite this remarkable sentence near the end of the August 5 lyophilizer story in the Washington Post:
No one, to my knowledge, has ever reported that any of the anthrax letters were mailed from anywhere but the box on Nassau Street in Princeton. Given that the sentence was deep in the story, and not supported in the story by any evidence, I’m assuming that it’s an error.
I phoned and emailed one of the three bylined reporters. Because this ‘fact’ has already entered the Wikipedia entry on the anthrax letters, it’s especially urgent that it be promptly and prominently corrected or supported by the Post.
If anyone can point to previous reporting of a different mailing location, please note it here. Some stories have, through less careful phrasing, given the impression that some or all the letters were mailed from Trenton; the basis for the error is that the return address on the letters had a Trenton-area zip code.
AP idiots strike again:
These two “reporters” should be fired and never allowed to play act in that job any more.
Perhaps I am simply less organized than most then. And I’m not sure where the timer is — it is just in the area with the hood and the bunny suit, or does it include the time he is in the building (i.e., the office, the bathroom, and the kitchenette with the coffee pot, that sort of thing). Also, since it is only time elapsed, not time in and out — did he punctually arrive at the same time every day and leave at exactly the same time or was just the elapsed time the same?
Not to belabor the point, but I am surprised that there wasn’t at least a minute or two differential. I just recently finished an experiment where it took me 2 hours to process 24 samples, and I managed to wrap things up pretty close to 2 hours for each batch of 24. I didn’t time it to the minute, but I would be exceedingly surprised if I was done in exactly the same amount of time down to the minute for each batch.
somewhat OT- “Horton will discuss the Hamdan conviction at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba at 12:15PM Eastern.”
http://www.antiwar.com/blog/20.....war-radio/
also Suskind on bush lies on Fresh Air in a few minutes.
http://www.npr.org/templates/r.....p?prgId=13
I was smiling when I said that…
Seriously, though, that post is one reason that EW and FDL readers are more attuned to this story than some.
A more likely scenario is that they will be given Russert- like status or pulled into Woodward’s circle of influence, in this and future neocon cabals.
What is missing for me is the trail of contamination. If these envelopes leaked enough to kill mail handlers there would probably be some contamination back to the lab, like in Ivan’s car. Possibly on his clothing, and back to his house. He could have contaminated the entire lab, or his home.
These issues are not unavoidable, but they needed to be addressed within days of 9/11.
I’m somewhat skeptical that all these elements could be pulled together within days.
Circumstantial evidence is still evidence, even if it’s of limited value. Their deduction is sound: there’s a good chance the mailer wouldn’t have thought about envelopes and that therefore he comes from the vicinity of possible post offices. The problem is not with this limited evidence, it’s that it was misrepresented at the press conference.
That, to me, is amazing. All from Princeton, really?
If these envelopes leaked enough to kill mail handlers
Agreed that there should have been a sign of contamination somewhere regardless, as there was at the box where they were mailed, but at the mail processing facility the letters are subjected to intense shaking and pounding.
If the mailer understood what happens at postal centers, s/he would have known s/he was almost certainly going to kill some postal workers.
Miller got her fake anthrax Oct. 12, between the brown and clumpy batch and the lethal second round.
This surmise has a lot of flaws, but could this mailing have been a justification for her to take Cipro (I’m presuming she did)?
That’s how it’s always been reported, unless someone can point me to media or FBI statements otherwise.
OT to anthrax but on topic to the cowed and compliant federal judiciary from Howard Bashman’s appellate site. One more reason to educate the bitter Hilliranistas who are so mad about the 200 millionairess that they want to vote for McFederalist Society judiciary :
Senate Stall to Let Next President Tip Court Balance (Update1)
Current Fed Judiciary Vacancies left to Next President
Future Fed Judiciary Vacancies
I have to say, if all we know is that the envelopes showed a ‘transient’ error, we cannot judge whether their deductions are sound or not. Envelopes with these errors could be spread like measles through the country and the FBI or someone just happened to find a batch that went to MD & VA. And we are supposed to believe that there is a mechanism in place to track flawed envelopes when so much else in the gov’t is held together with chewing gum?
White House memo exposes Rove knew of problems with anthrax vaccine
new on Raw Story
Bmaz, it didn’t seem to me that Leahy was asking just in the capacity of victim or he might have chosen a different setting. To me, his tone suggested he had information and he was disappointed DOJ wasn’t acting on it. And it does seem possible that the pressure from him upped the pressure on Ivins. Is there any chance Leahy’s office heard from Duley?
Maybe the envelopes were flawed because they were forged envelopes. Were they creamy?
A compulsive perfectionist acting alone, it seems to me, would have difficulty forcing himself to send out anthrax not of the highest available quality lethality-wise.
Also, Leahy went to the top which suggests he was looking for pressure to be exerted from the top down.
Why are none of the many reporters now assigned to this story asking bmaz’s questions about the body and the autopsy? If they’re asking and getting refusals to answer, they should be reporting that.
It’s such a basic question in a murky suicide that I can’t believe it’s not being addressed more directly. I wonder if the lawyer Kemp knows the answers.
So far the sole hint of a reference to an autopsy is in a Frederick Post story where some spokesperson refused to discuss “results from the autopsy”, implying that there was one.
Thank you, Marcy:
Yes, ‘this’ is ALL your ‘fault’.
Please continue being ‘blameworthy’, Dr. Accountability.
Thanks, as well, to the rest of you who comment so knowledgeablly here every day.
‘This’ is all a most remarkable ‘education’. I am sincerely in debt to all of your collective wisdoms and insights.
It’s possible that the time is recorded in 15 minute increments. Again, it would help to know if that’s the case. This information is known to the investigators. Why didn’t they bother sharing it?
Note the cast of characters in this story…even includes Whittington and Joe Albaugh:
http://www.bushwatch.com/gravedigger.htm
This site, linked to by emptywheel, identifies only one mailbox, for the second mailing, which doesn’t eliminate the possibility of other mailboxes for the first.
He has some kind of key card, if I recall correctly, so they’d have exact times of entry, unless we’re talking about time he logged in a time entry system.
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/....._0807.html
White House memo exposes Rove knew of problems with anthrax vaccine
and this:
After the attacks of September 11th, President George Walker Bush placed BioPort’s North Lansing laboratory under protection, invoking the national interest. Interestingly enough, the Italian magazine Il Manifesto reported, in its October issue, that this happened at the same time that the FBI also placed the El Hibri’s at the top of their list of suspects for sending anthraxspores through the mail system. “
Did our President stall and impede another investigation?
There is one possible reason why our President does not want anyone looking into the matter since BioPort and George Herbert Walker Bush are connected via Carlyle Group.
Nothing impresses me more than to see present and former military persons stand up for those that are currently in uniform and being treated wrong or shabbily by the current occupant of the White House after they have served this nation and remain vigilant because they know that there are some real “sleaze persons” in the DoD, our government and certain defense contractors:
WILFULLY RISKING THE HEALTH OF THE US MILITARY[3]
by: MAJ GLENN MacDONALD, USAR (Ret)
Al Capone would have been proud.
?
“Former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Adm. William J. Crowe Jr. was part of the crew who sold Saddam Hussein the deadly means to wage war with anthrax germs. The United States wanted the “Butcher of Baghdad” to use anthrax on Iran.
Now the admiral, who shocked political observers by endorsing Bill “I loathe the military” Clinton in 1992 and was rewarded the following year with the post of ambassador to Great Britain, gets a “sweetheart deal” from the Pentagon to produce a questionable “vaccine” that is supposed to “protect” the nation’s military from the deadly organisms.
Not only does Crowe and his mysterious pal, Faud El-Hibri, get an exclusive multi-million dollar contract to produce anthrax vaccine, but the Government agrees to pay triple the original cost in the contract, from $3.50 a dose, to over ten dollars! This, after the company Crowe and El-Hibri partly own - Bioport of Lansing, Mich. - was temporarily shut down by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) after it failed an inspection in November.”
FOLLOW THE MONEY
http://www.rense.com/general82/rats.htm
Shouldn’t someone be working in a reference to “The Purloined Letter” at some point?
I thought we’d moved on to “The Cask of Amontillado.” I believe that “Into the Maelstrom” comes next.
Drat. I’m sorry to have missed Horton. Must look to see what he’s written on Hamdan.
Read my link at #78. Bioport is Emergent solutions before it changed its name. Joe Albaugh…
As with everything else, including much of medicine, the manufacture of anthrax vaccines has been politicized. There are a number of companies, labs, and universities in vaccine trial programs that are ongoing. I wanted the vaccine after the letters, and at first a search told me I would have to travel 600 miles every time I got a successive shot. About that time, a program opened up for me to get it locally, and I took it. Only a literal handful of doctors did, because they were “skeeereeed” and didn’t use their usual ability to read and metabolize medical information for the benefit of their patients when the patient was them.
The government drove the major manufacture of military vaccines out of business, and now the Bioshed program by your Bannana Republic of the “Jeff Taylor Karl Rove dominated homeland government” is a clusterfuck of sorts.
But if you haven’t gotten the point–you are to be barely seen and absolutely not heard from like a well managed proletariat . Maybe all you dirty dissident rabble rousing hippies need to reread “1984.” BTW your kids won’t be reading it, and for those of you who have kids who haven’t graduated middle school or high school yet I have an interesting experiment. Right click your kid’s desktop>notebook and ask them tomake a list of the books they’ve read since the sixth grade. It’s not going to take but a minute. There aren’t going to be many, and 1984 won’t be on it. If there are more than 20 of the classics that you read, I’d be damn amazed. I ask that question of the kids in the high school down the street from me all the time. Most of them who are college bound read next to no books. I know the Digital Imaging teachers and the English teachers and they confirm what I’ve just said. It’s a whole different paradigm from the reading lists you might have gotten.
But back to vaccines. Most companies have dropped out of their manufacture although some studies still take place with small groups of volunteers. Most physicians given the opportunity to receive anthrax vaccines and boosters have avoided them like a big pile of dog shit on the side walk mostly due to ignorance of those physicians.
Emergent based in Rockville, Md. manufactures Anthrax vaccine in Lansing, Michigan after successfully defeating Vaxgen on the government contract.
You can read about