Comments on: Back to the Question of ABC’s Sources http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/ Tue, 24 Nov 2009 04:46:47 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: timbo http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-65297 timbo Mon, 21 Apr 2008 19:02:21 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-65297 <p>It would seem that folks are getting in line to now get a free cup of Ignorance™. Which line were they standing in when all the torture caldron was a brewing?</p> It would seem that folks are getting in line to now get a free cup of Ignorance™. Which line were they standing in when all the torture caldron was a brewing?

]]> By: JohnLopresti http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-64991 JohnLopresti Sat, 19 Apr 2008 17:43:04 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-64991 <p>The CQ article: <a href="http://public.cq.com/docs/hs/hsnews110-000002697912.html" rel="nofollow">published last week</a>; what seemed striking was less what the ostensible theme of the article is, but more curious are the links, both viable and those of websites taken down since the article appeared, though the author cites passages that had been available; plus, in typical CQ fashion, the narrative provides a sense of the currents of influence in modern policy toward executive detentions.</p> The CQ article: published last week; what seemed striking was less what the ostensible theme of the article is, but more curious are the links, both viable and those of websites taken down since the article appeared, though the author cites passages that had been available; plus, in typical CQ fashion, the narrative provides a sense of the currents of influence in modern policy toward executive detentions.

]]> By: dude http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-64973 dude Sat, 19 Apr 2008 14:27:12 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-64973 <p>I am reading this as a non-lawyer/non-law enforcment person and I all I can think of is: where does Pixie-dust come in?</p> I am reading this as a non-lawyer/non-law enforcment person and I all I can think of is: where does Pixie-dust come in?

]]> By: klynn http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-64967 klynn Sat, 19 Apr 2008 13:48:03 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-64967 <p>that would be USAJ story…</p> that would be USAJ story…

]]> By: klynn http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-64966 klynn Sat, 19 Apr 2008 13:47:21 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-64966 <p>Catching up here. Was gone yesterday PM so missed this thread going up. </p> <p>MD</p> <p>to back you up on your theory…</p> <p>Mueller has been a source for Jan Crawford Greenberg a few times. Why, just a year ago he confirmed that Gonzo was a liar for her news source on the UAAJ story.</p> Catching up here. Was gone yesterday PM so missed this thread going up.

MD

to back you up on your theory…

Mueller has been a source for Jan Crawford Greenberg a few times. Why, just a year ago he confirmed that Gonzo was a liar for her news source on the UAAJ story.

]]> By: JohnLopresti http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-64957 JohnLopresti Sat, 19 Apr 2008 04:24:33 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-64957 <p>-39, M, those cites you provided were about the same incident; it is widely commented, even at Congressional Quarterly, that the agencies had early disputes at the beginning of Gitmo regarding what was illegal, though material in links were appearing throughout the process from DTA to MCA as congress tried the bafflegab exercise one of whose most famous caricatures you also reference, not a hapless toad, just Mr.Magoo. I thought the ambience of anxiety motivated a lot of pols in congress to ignore the problem. Something like globalWarming, surely, if we sell credits, call it capAndTrade, it will be an issue that goes away, taking with it the fraction of the biota which less thermophilic than, say, mammalian existence and most cellular life, a disparate topic.</p> -39, M, those cites you provided were about the same incident; it is widely commented, even at Congressional Quarterly, that the agencies had early disputes at the beginning of Gitmo regarding what was illegal, though material in links were appearing throughout the process from DTA to MCA as congress tried the bafflegab exercise one of whose most famous caricatures you also reference, not a hapless toad, just Mr.Magoo. I thought the ambience of anxiety motivated a lot of pols in congress to ignore the problem. Something like globalWarming, surely, if we sell credits, call it capAndTrade, it will be an issue that goes away, taking with it the fraction of the biota which less thermophilic than, say, mammalian existence and most cellular life, a disparate topic.

]]> By: readerOfTeaLeaves http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-64950 readerOfTeaLeaves Sat, 19 Apr 2008 03:14:00 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-64950 <p>Perhaps you are correct. The passage stated: </p> <blockquote><p>• Myers believes he was a victim of “<em>intrigue” by top lawyers at the department of justice, the office of the vice president, Dick Cheney, and Donald Rumsfeld’s defence department</em>.</p> <p>• Myers <em>wrongly believed</em> interrogation techniques had been taken from the army’s field manual.</p> <p><em>The lawyers who pushed through the interrogation techniques -<strong> all of them political appointees</strong> </em>- were Alberto Gonzales, David Addingon and William Haynes.</p> <p>Others involved were Doug Feith, Rumsfeld’s undersecretary for policy, and Jay Bybee and John Yoo, two assistant attorney generals.</p></blockquote> <p>We’ve seen these people lie unremittingly. It’s as if they’re a bunch of Humbert Humberts and Iraq/Iran is their Lolita fixation. </p> <p>I’m not holding Myers up for sainthood or martyrdom. However, these asshats lied to the US public (and our allies) about Niger yellowcake; given the scope and frequency of their lies, it’s a safe bet they also lied to Myers. I don’t think being lied to, and having to take a bit of extra time to figure out who’s lying, and about what, makes a person automatically incompetent. I think it makes them up against a more challenging, difficult situation.</p> <p>I’m not excusing Myers.<br /> I’m trying to point out, however, that the BushCheney + neocon (Wolfowitz, Hadley, Perle, etc, etc) must have been running rampant when Myers was COS. Having to track that many rats would have impaired anyone’s ability to look out for the military.<br /> That’s all I’m saying.</p> Perhaps you are correct. The passage stated:

• Myers believes he was a victim of “intrigue” by top lawyers at the department of justice, the office of the vice president, Dick Cheney, and Donald Rumsfeld’s defence department.

• Myers wrongly believed interrogation techniques had been taken from the army’s field manual.

The lawyers who pushed through the interrogation techniques - all of them political appointees - were Alberto Gonzales, David Addingon and William Haynes.

Others involved were Doug Feith, Rumsfeld’s undersecretary for policy, and Jay Bybee and John Yoo, two assistant attorney generals.

We’ve seen these people lie unremittingly. It’s as if they’re a bunch of Humbert Humberts and Iraq/Iran is their Lolita fixation.

I’m not holding Myers up for sainthood or martyrdom. However, these asshats lied to the US public (and our allies) about Niger yellowcake; given the scope and frequency of their lies, it’s a safe bet they also lied to Myers. I don’t think being lied to, and having to take a bit of extra time to figure out who’s lying, and about what, makes a person automatically incompetent. I think it makes them up against a more challenging, difficult situation.

I’m not excusing Myers.
I’m trying to point out, however, that the BushCheney + neocon (Wolfowitz, Hadley, Perle, etc, etc) must have been running rampant when Myers was COS. Having to track that many rats would have impaired anyone’s ability to look out for the military.
That’s all I’m saying.

]]> By: Minnesotachuck http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-64948 Minnesotachuck Sat, 19 Apr 2008 02:33:29 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-64948 <p>I think it <strong>was</strong> Butterfield, responding to a query as to why he hadn’t previously mentioned the White House taping system prior to doing so before a Congressional committee.</p> I think it was Butterfield, responding to a query as to why he hadn’t previously mentioned the White House taping system prior to doing so before a Congressional committee.

]]> By: kspena http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-64943 kspena Sat, 19 Apr 2008 01:28:40 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-64943 <p>Here’s Philippe Sands article in tomorrow’s Guardian Weekend:</p> <p><a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/apr/19/humanrights.interrogationtechniques" rel="nofollow">http://www.guardian.co.uk/worl.....techniques</a></p> Here’s Philippe Sands article in tomorrow’s Guardian Weekend:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/worl…..techniques

]]> By: earlofhuntingdon http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/comment-page-1/#comment-64940 earlofhuntingdon Sat, 19 Apr 2008 00:49:04 +0000 http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/18/back-to-the-question-of-abcs-sources/#comment-64940 <p>Like Bush, they report to a higher father. Their time at the DOJ was their place in the sun. They placed personal loyalty to leader ahead of their institutional and professional obligations, happily justifying it, which is emblematic of their approach to law and management issues. </p> <p>Monica Goodling, for example, happily violated employment law requirements because they conflicted with her personal and religious beliefs. She’ll be a candidate for the federal bench under the next Gooper administration. She and her ilk are the farm team for the people Cheney actually trusts, like Addington.</p> Like Bush, they report to a higher father. Their time at the DOJ was their place in the sun. They placed personal loyalty to leader ahead of their institutional and professional obligations, happily justifying it, which is emblematic of their approach to law and management issues.

Monica Goodling, for example, happily violated employment law requirements because they conflicted with her personal and religious beliefs. She’ll be a candidate for the federal bench under the next Gooper administration. She and her ilk are the farm team for the people Cheney actually trusts, like Addington.

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