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	<title>Comments on: Who &#8220;We&#8221; Included in the Torture Briefings</title>
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		<title>By: maryo2</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63640</link>
		<dc:creator>maryo2</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 19:48:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63640</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;106 - I did that for copying and pasting ease for anyone who needs it.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>106 &#8211; I did that for copying and pasting ease for anyone who needs it.</p>
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		<title>By: maryo2</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63638</link>
		<dc:creator>maryo2</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 19:44:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63638</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The White House&lt;br /&gt;
Washington&lt;br /&gt;
February 7, 2002&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Memorandum for&lt;br /&gt;
	The Vice President [Dick Cheney]&lt;br /&gt;
	The Secretary of State [Colin Powell]&lt;br /&gt;
	The Secretary of Defense [Donald Rumsfeld]&lt;br /&gt;
	The Attorney General [John Ashcroft]&lt;br /&gt;
	Chief of Staff to the President [Andrew Card]&lt;br /&gt;
	Director of Central Intelligence [George Tenet]&lt;br /&gt;
	Assitant to the President for National Security Affairs [Condoleezza Rice]&lt;br /&gt;
	Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff [General Richard Myers]&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;SUBJECT : Humane Treatment of a1 Qaeda and Taliban Detainees&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;1. Our recent extensive discussions regarding the status&lt;br /&gt;
of a1Qaeda and Taliban detainees confirm that the application&lt;br /&gt;
of the Geneva Convention Relative to the Treatment&lt;br /&gt;
of Prisoners of War of August 12, 1949 (Geneva) to the&lt;br /&gt;
conflict with a1 Qaeda and the Taliban involve complex&lt;br /&gt;
legal questions. By its terms, Geneva applies to conflicts&lt;br /&gt;
involving “High Contracting Parties” which can only be&lt;br /&gt;
states. Moreover, it assumes the existence of “regular”&lt;br /&gt;
armed forces fighting on behalf of states. However, the&lt;br /&gt;
war against terrorism ushers in new paradigm, one in&lt;br /&gt;
which groups with broad, international reach commit horrific&lt;br /&gt;
acts against innocent civilians sometimes with the direct&lt;br /&gt;
support of states. Our Nation recognizes that this new&lt;br /&gt;
paradigm — ushered in not by us, but by terrorists –&lt;br /&gt;
requires new thinking in the law of war, but thinking that&lt;br /&gt;
nevertheless be consistent with the principles of Geneva.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;2. Pursuant to my authority as Commander in Chief and Chief&lt;br /&gt;
Executive of the United States, and relying on the opinion&lt;br /&gt;
of the Department of Justice dated January 22, 2002, and on&lt;br /&gt;
the legal opinion rendered by the Attorney General in his&lt;br /&gt;
letter of February 1, 2002, thereby determine as follows:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;a. I accept the legal conclusion of the Department of&lt;br /&gt;
Justice and determine that none of the provisions&lt;br /&gt;
of Geneva apply to our conflicts with a1 Qaeda in&lt;br /&gt;
Afghanistan or elsewhere throughout the world because,&lt;br /&gt;
among other reasons, a1 Qaeda is not a High Contracting&lt;br /&gt;
Party to Geneva.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;b. I accept the legal conclusion of the Attorney General&lt;br /&gt;
and the Department of Justice that I have the authority&lt;br /&gt;
under the Constitution to suspend Geneva as between&lt;br /&gt;
the United States and Afghanistan, but I decline to&lt;br /&gt;
exercise that authority at this time.  Accordingly I&lt;br /&gt;
determine that the provisions of Geneva will apply to our&lt;br /&gt;
present conflict with the Taliban. I reserve the right&lt;br /&gt;
to exercise this authority in this or future conflicts.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;c. I also accept the legal conclusion of the Department of&lt;br /&gt;
Justice and determine that common Article 3 of Geneva&lt;br /&gt;
does not apply to either a1 Qaeda or Taliban detainees,&lt;br /&gt;
because, among other reasons the relevant conflicts&lt;br /&gt;
are international in scope and common Article 3 applies&lt;br /&gt;
only to “armed conflict not of an international character.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;d. Based on the facts supplied by the Department of&lt;br /&gt;
Defense and the recommendation of the Department of&lt;br /&gt;
Justice, I determine that the Taliban detainees are&lt;br /&gt;
unlawful combatants and, therefore, do not qualify as&lt;br /&gt;
prisoners of war under Article 4 of Geneva. I note&lt;br /&gt;
that, because Geneva does not apply to our conflict&lt;br /&gt;
with a1 Qaeda, a1 Qaeda detainees also do not qualify&lt;br /&gt;
as prisoners of war.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;3. Of course, our values as a Nation, values that we share&lt;br /&gt;
with many nations in the world, call for us to treat detainees&lt;br /&gt;
humanely, including those who are not legally entitled to&lt;br /&gt;
such treatment.  Our Nation has been and will continue to&lt;br /&gt;
be a strong supporter of Geneva and its principles.  As&lt;br /&gt;
a matter of policy, the United States Armed Forces shall&lt;br /&gt;
continue to treat detainees humanely and, to the extent&lt;br /&gt;
appropriate and consistent with military necessity, in&lt;br /&gt;
a manner consistent with the principles of Geneva.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;4. The United States will hold states, organizations, and&lt;br /&gt;
individuals who gain control of United States personnel&lt;br /&gt;
responsible for treating such personnel humanely and&lt;br /&gt;
consistent with applicable law.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;5. I hereby reaffirm the order previously issued by the&lt;br /&gt;
Secretary of Defense to the United State Armed Forces&lt;br /&gt;
requiring that the detainees be treated humanely and,&lt;br /&gt;
to the extent appropriate and consistent with military&lt;br /&gt;
necessity, in a manner consistent with the principles&lt;br /&gt;
of Geneva.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;6. I hereby direct the Secretary of State to communicate my&lt;br /&gt;
determinations in an appropriate manner to our allies, and&lt;br /&gt;
other countries and international organizations cooperating&lt;br /&gt;
in the war against terrorism of global reach.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;-George Bush&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The White House<br />
Washington<br />
February 7, 2002</p>
<p>Memorandum for<br />
	The Vice President [Dick Cheney]<br />
	The Secretary of State [Colin Powell]<br />
	The Secretary of Defense [Donald Rumsfeld]<br />
	The Attorney General [John Ashcroft]<br />
	Chief of Staff to the President [Andrew Card]<br />
	Director of Central Intelligence [George Tenet]<br />
	Assitant to the President for National Security Affairs [Condoleezza Rice]<br />
	Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff [General Richard Myers]</p>
<p>SUBJECT : Humane Treatment of a1 Qaeda and Taliban Detainees</p>
<p>1. Our recent extensive discussions regarding the status<br />
of a1Qaeda and Taliban detainees confirm that the application<br />
of the Geneva Convention Relative to the Treatment<br />
of Prisoners of War of August 12, 1949 (Geneva) to the<br />
conflict with a1 Qaeda and the Taliban involve complex<br />
legal questions. By its terms, Geneva applies to conflicts<br />
involving “High Contracting Parties” which can only be<br />
states. Moreover, it assumes the existence of “regular”<br />
armed forces fighting on behalf of states. However, the<br />
war against terrorism ushers in new paradigm, one in<br />
which groups with broad, international reach commit horrific<br />
acts against innocent civilians sometimes with the direct<br />
support of states. Our Nation recognizes that this new<br />
paradigm — ushered in not by us, but by terrorists –<br />
requires new thinking in the law of war, but thinking that<br />
nevertheless be consistent with the principles of Geneva.</p>
<p>2. Pursuant to my authority as Commander in Chief and Chief<br />
Executive of the United States, and relying on the opinion<br />
of the Department of Justice dated January 22, 2002, and on<br />
the legal opinion rendered by the Attorney General in his<br />
letter of February 1, 2002, thereby determine as follows:</p>
<p>a. I accept the legal conclusion of the Department of<br />
Justice and determine that none of the provisions<br />
of Geneva apply to our conflicts with a1 Qaeda in<br />
Afghanistan or elsewhere throughout the world because,<br />
among other reasons, a1 Qaeda is not a High Contracting<br />
Party to Geneva.</p>
<p>b. I accept the legal conclusion of the Attorney General<br />
and the Department of Justice that I have the authority<br />
under the Constitution to suspend Geneva as between<br />
the United States and Afghanistan, but I decline to<br />
exercise that authority at this time.  Accordingly I<br />
determine that the provisions of Geneva will apply to our<br />
present conflict with the Taliban. I reserve the right<br />
to exercise this authority in this or future conflicts.</p>
<p>c. I also accept the legal conclusion of the Department of<br />
Justice and determine that common Article 3 of Geneva<br />
does not apply to either a1 Qaeda or Taliban detainees,<br />
because, among other reasons the relevant conflicts<br />
are international in scope and common Article 3 applies<br />
only to “armed conflict not of an international character.”</p>
<p>d. Based on the facts supplied by the Department of<br />
Defense and the recommendation of the Department of<br />
Justice, I determine that the Taliban detainees are<br />
unlawful combatants and, therefore, do not qualify as<br />
prisoners of war under Article 4 of Geneva. I note<br />
that, because Geneva does not apply to our conflict<br />
with a1 Qaeda, a1 Qaeda detainees also do not qualify<br />
as prisoners of war.</p>
<p>3. Of course, our values as a Nation, values that we share<br />
with many nations in the world, call for us to treat detainees<br />
humanely, including those who are not legally entitled to<br />
such treatment.  Our Nation has been and will continue to<br />
be a strong supporter of Geneva and its principles.  As<br />
a matter of policy, the United States Armed Forces shall<br />
continue to treat detainees humanely and, to the extent<br />
appropriate and consistent with military necessity, in<br />
a manner consistent with the principles of Geneva.</p>
<p>4. The United States will hold states, organizations, and<br />
individuals who gain control of United States personnel<br />
responsible for treating such personnel humanely and<br />
consistent with applicable law.</p>
<p>5. I hereby reaffirm the order previously issued by the<br />
Secretary of Defense to the United State Armed Forces<br />
requiring that the detainees be treated humanely and,<br />
to the extent appropriate and consistent with military<br />
necessity, in a manner consistent with the principles<br />
of Geneva.</p>
<p>6. I hereby direct the Secretary of State to communicate my<br />
determinations in an appropriate manner to our allies, and<br />
other countries and international organizations cooperating<br />
in the war against terrorism of global reach.</p>
<p>-George Bush</p>
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		<title>By: maryo2</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63606</link>
		<dc:creator>maryo2</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 16:47:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63606</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Underdogs vs. Topdogs &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Rhymy things like this are the kinds of soundbites that Progressives should pour into the MSM.  It lets people comprehend what is happening without putting any effort into each individual player.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Underdogs vs. Topdogs </p>
<p>Rhymy things like this are the kinds of soundbites that Progressives should pour into the MSM.  It lets people comprehend what is happening without putting any effort into each individual player.</p>
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		<title>By: danps</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63605</link>
		<dc:creator>danps</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 16:25:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63605</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Oh and by the way, an additional feature of our torture regime is that we now get to hear the Iranian media &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=50715&amp;sectionid=3510203&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;crow about&lt;/a&gt; how lousy we are on human rights.  We’re keeping some awesome company these days.  W. might be attending the opening ceremony just so he doesn’t risk China pointing out the obvious.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh and by the way, an additional feature of our torture regime is that we now get to hear the Iranian media <a href="http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=50715&amp;sectionid=3510203" rel="nofollow">crow about</a> how lousy we are on human rights.  We’re keeping some awesome company these days.  W. might be attending the opening ceremony just so he doesn’t risk China pointing out the obvious.</p>
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		<title>By: klynn</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63601</link>
		<dc:creator>klynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 15:54:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63601</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Sorry I posted twice.  I guess two out of four attempts on the tubes is pretty good when the screen seems to refresh and go blank when I click “submit”.  Something is up on my end I imagine.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Mary, when you listen, make sure you are out of ear shot of others — especially children.  You might be surprised what will come out of you as you listen to their horror…&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry I posted twice.  I guess two out of four attempts on the tubes is pretty good when the screen seems to refresh and go blank when I click “submit”.  Something is up on my end I imagine.</p>
<p>Mary, when you listen, make sure you are out of ear shot of others — especially children.  You might be surprised what will come out of you as you listen to their horror…</p>
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		<title>By: radiofreewill</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63599</link>
		<dc:creator>radiofreewill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 15:39:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63599</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;While I’m really curious as to who was ‘on-board’ with The President’s Torture Program, and who was ‘duped,’ as well as who stood their ground on Principles and Rejected Cruel and Inhumane Treatment of Other Human Beings, it does seem clear that the article references ’sources’ from both the Briefers’ and Briefees’ sides.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;IOW, witnesses to the Whole Story are indicating that by putting their stories together, it would be possible to discern Who Were the Torture-Authorizers.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;This is the point in the game where the Chessplayer realizes he’s already in a Mating Net…&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;We should get to see some Gooper Coping Skills on display in the not too distant future.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I’m really curious as to who was ‘on-board’ with The President’s Torture Program, and who was ‘duped,’ as well as who stood their ground on Principles and Rejected Cruel and Inhumane Treatment of Other Human Beings, it does seem clear that the article references ’sources’ from both the Briefers’ and Briefees’ sides.</p>
<p>IOW, witnesses to the Whole Story are indicating that by putting their stories together, it would be possible to discern Who Were the Torture-Authorizers.</p>
<p>This is the point in the game where the Chessplayer realizes he’s already in a Mating Net…</p>
<p>We should get to see some Gooper Coping Skills on display in the not too distant future.</p>
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		<title>By: Mary</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63598</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 15:38:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63598</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;98 - thanks for that link - I am about to disappear into a lot of work, but maybe I can borrow some headphones and listen to that while I am doing real work too.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>98 &#8211; thanks for that link &#8211; I am about to disappear into a lot of work, but maybe I can borrow some headphones and listen to that while I am doing real work too.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Mary</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63596</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 15:34:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63596</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;55 - Yes, some did that, but I think there are lots of problems with that attitude, since with the current court, it was a tough job for Stevens to cobble his 5 for the Hamdan opinion, and they relied VERY HEAVILY on what the UCMJ said and that the President couldn’t legislate around what Congress had passed.  The MCA does a very good job (too bad Yoo was gone and they had more competent drafters involved) of addressing and puncturing all the arguments on which Stevens rested his opinion. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And if you end up with some directly competing statements from Congress (like adoption of the GCs and generic references several places in UCMJ about the principles v. the “have at ‘em boys” express and implicit provisions of the DTA and MCA) the Court will pretty much have to go with the most recent expressions. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Not only did the MCA murder the arguments in Hamdan, it went back and killed the grounds for habeas that were established in Rasul and which did not have to be addressed directly when the Court considered the DTA, because the Court decided the DTA was only for “future” cases and not for pending cases.  Not only does MCA make it for all cases, but it suspends habeas pretty much everywhere but the US, not just at GITMO.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So they are going to need some new arguments, new grounds, new approaches.  The problem there is a mish mash of cases with wildly varying facts and different levels of legal expertise in the representations and different GOALS in the representation as well, so that there is not really a good, solid, systematic way to approach the worst aspects of the legislation - it’s going to be catch as catch can on what the Court does, for example, on Boumedain(sp) and it’s specific arguments and facts.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I do like the original ruling at GITMO, though, about the failure of the MCA and the failure of all the CSRTs to include “unlawful” or “illegal” in the combatant status findings.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Reid and all the passive aggressive assists from so many Dems well and thoroughly screwed the nation and I find it very hard to like any of them.   &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;60 - that’s just the guy that google images gives you when you put in “limbo” on restricted safe search.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;62 - I think you some good points on Hadley.  If he was the “source” griping about why they don’t just do things and instead keep coming back and TELLING the Principals all about what they are going to do, then I have to ask - - - who feels good about the fact that Congress dropped, Good Little Soldier, Sacrifice My Troops For My Boss’ Vanity Any Day, Hayden into Tenet’s slot?  That “only waterboarded three” - sez who?  Is that when the briefings stopped because now CIA was just getting it done, not talking about it?  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;88 - or that Afghan becoming someone’s idea of a “failed state” dis-in-contracted them. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;95 - Not that odd. The order has been out for a long time and the fact that Bush created this “unlawful enemy combatant” concept has been kicked to the curb a few times.  It ties directly to the January Gonzales memo released back during his confirmations.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>55 &#8211; Yes, some did that, but I think there are lots of problems with that attitude, since with the current court, it was a tough job for Stevens to cobble his 5 for the Hamdan opinion, and they relied VERY HEAVILY on what the UCMJ said and that the President couldn’t legislate around what Congress had passed.  The MCA does a very good job (too bad Yoo was gone and they had more competent drafters involved) of addressing and puncturing all the arguments on which Stevens rested his opinion. </p>
<p>And if you end up with some directly competing statements from Congress (like adoption of the GCs and generic references several places in UCMJ about the principles v. the “have at ‘em boys” express and implicit provisions of the DTA and MCA) the Court will pretty much have to go with the most recent expressions. </p>
<p>Not only did the MCA murder the arguments in Hamdan, it went back and killed the grounds for habeas that were established in Rasul and which did not have to be addressed directly when the Court considered the DTA, because the Court decided the DTA was only for “future” cases and not for pending cases.  Not only does MCA make it for all cases, but it suspends habeas pretty much everywhere but the US, not just at GITMO.</p>
<p>So they are going to need some new arguments, new grounds, new approaches.  The problem there is a mish mash of cases with wildly varying facts and different levels of legal expertise in the representations and different GOALS in the representation as well, so that there is not really a good, solid, systematic way to approach the worst aspects of the legislation &#8211; it’s going to be catch as catch can on what the Court does, for example, on Boumedain(sp) and it’s specific arguments and facts.</p>
<p>I do like the original ruling at GITMO, though, about the failure of the MCA and the failure of all the CSRTs to include “unlawful” or “illegal” in the combatant status findings.  </p>
<p>Reid and all the passive aggressive assists from so many Dems well and thoroughly screwed the nation and I find it very hard to like any of them.   </p>
<p>60 &#8211; that’s just the guy that google images gives you when you put in “limbo” on restricted safe search.</p>
<p>62 &#8211; I think you some good points on Hadley.  If he was the “source” griping about why they don’t just do things and instead keep coming back and TELLING the Principals all about what they are going to do, then I have to ask &#8211; - &#8211; who feels good about the fact that Congress dropped, Good Little Soldier, Sacrifice My Troops For My Boss’ Vanity Any Day, Hayden into Tenet’s slot?  That “only waterboarded three” &#8211; sez who?  Is that when the briefings stopped because now CIA was just getting it done, not talking about it?  </p>
<p>88 &#8211; or that Afghan becoming someone’s idea of a “failed state” dis-in-contracted them. </p>
<p>95 &#8211; Not that odd. The order has been out for a long time and the fact that Bush created this “unlawful enemy combatant” concept has been kicked to the curb a few times.  It ties directly to the January Gonzales memo released back during his confirmations.</p>
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		<title>By: klynn</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63595</link>
		<dc:creator>klynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 15:14:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63595</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;EW,&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I have tried to post a comment regarding Donald Vance and Nathan Ertel a few times.  Every attempt has been lost for some reason…&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;One last try here.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In honor of the anniversary of Vance’s return to the US and their suit filing, I recommend this Chicago NPR story. It’s  24 minutes long.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.chicagopublicradio.org/Content.aspx?audioID=10073&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.chicagopublicradio......ioID=10073&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I am sure neither is surprised by this round of torture information…&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>EW,</p>
<p>I have tried to post a comment regarding Donald Vance and Nathan Ertel a few times.  Every attempt has been lost for some reason…</p>
<p>One last try here.</p>
<p>In honor of the anniversary of Vance’s return to the US and their suit filing, I recommend this Chicago NPR story. It’s  24 minutes long.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.chicagopublicradio.org/Content.aspx?audioID=10073" rel="nofollow">http://www.chicagopublicradio&#8230;&#8230;ioID=10073</a></p>
<p>I am sure neither is surprised by this round of torture information…</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: klynn</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/comment-page-2/#comment-63594</link>
		<dc:creator>klynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Apr 2008 15:09:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2008/04/10/who-we-included-in-the-torture-briefings/#comment-63594</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;We are in the anniversary season of Donald Vance’s return to the US and the Donald Vance &amp; Nathan Ertel v. Donald Rumsfeld original filing.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In light of new (not really) information, I wonder what changes for Vance &amp; Ertel?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;For a revisit to their story there are links below… If you have 25 minutes, the Chicago Public Radio piece is well worth listening to. Every time I listen, I’m struck by the constant failure of this administrations policies.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://chicago.indymedia.org/newswire/display/75433/index.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://chicago.indymedia.org/n...../index.php&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/04/05/337/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.commondreams.org/ar.....04/05/337/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/8/24/22411/1187&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/8/24/22411/1187&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.chicagopublicradio.org/Content.aspx?audioID=10073&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.chicagopublicradio......ioID=10073&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We are in the anniversary season of Donald Vance’s return to the US and the Donald Vance &amp; Nathan Ertel v. Donald Rumsfeld original filing.</p>
<p>In light of new (not really) information, I wonder what changes for Vance &amp; Ertel?</p>
<p>For a revisit to their story there are links below… If you have 25 minutes, the Chicago Public Radio piece is well worth listening to. Every time I listen, I’m struck by the constant failure of this administrations policies.</p>
<p><a href="http://chicago.indymedia.org/newswire/display/75433/index.php" rel="nofollow">http://chicago.indymedia.org/n&#8230;../index.php</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/04/05/337/" rel="nofollow">http://www.commondreams.org/ar&#8230;..04/05/337/</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/8/24/22411/1187" rel="nofollow">http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/8/24/22411/1187</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.chicagopublicradio.org/Content.aspx?audioID=10073" rel="nofollow">http://www.chicagopublicradio&#8230;&#8230;ioID=10073</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
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