Comments on: Another Stupid Idea to Exacerbate the Clusterfuck

By: siftingthrough

siftingthrough — Sat, 15 Mar 2008 07:16:36 +0000

Rayne said it perfectly

If you mean the DNC when you say “Democrats”, know that these are people who are elected by the state parties across the entire U.S.; this is a point at which things can get a bit murky, since machine politics can produce only those delegates to the DNC that they want, instead of grassroots representatives. But the entire DNC voted for the rules we are supposed to operate under; it’s not left entirely up to the machine politicians of any one state. It’s hard to game the entire enchilada.

Give it a rest.

By: siftingthrough

siftingthrough — Sat, 15 Mar 2008 07:09:16 +0000

I object to this statement.
But those are precisely the geniuses who got us into the Clusterfuck in the first place!
How the hell do you figure that? Who besides the DNC Rules Comm. should make and enforce the Rules?
I’m bit tired of all the bloviating about superdelegates.In California we elect our DNC members and the elected officials answer to the Democrats in their districts.How should they vote? For their own choice?The way their district voted? The way the state voted? all are aware of the pressures surrounding the issue.Most will vote their conscience.

By: PetePierce

PetePierce — Fri, 14 Mar 2008 17:33:21 +0000

Also even the pages of the Conservative Murdock Wall Street Journal:

SIOBHAN GORMAN March 10, 2008NSA’s Domestic Spying Grows As Agency Sweeps Up Data

NSA’s Domestic Spying Grows As Agency Sweeps Up Data

By: PetePierce

PetePierce — Fri, 14 Mar 2008 17:20:32 +0000

Thanks for the links nolo. The hits just keep on comin’.

FBI Continues to Make Illegal Blanket Demands for Phone Records

By: JohnLopresti

JohnLopresti — Fri, 14 Mar 2008 17:13:27 +0000

The haste to be first primary was part Democratic party innate enthusiasm, and partly disdain for the lame conduct of policy as exercised by the 7 years of Bush2. So in that sense it was neat early to witness machine politics MI at some sort of confluence in synchrony with slow, evenly divided FL seeking to reform its own chad dinged image. It is reasonable that the national Democratic party organization seeks to remain responsive to both candidates, especially in the classically tumultuous process as it is currently, wherein the pole position in the race has changed as primaries progressed. I doubt any plebiscite will be fair or feasible this late in the year for MI’ers and FL’ans wishing for a full spectrum of choices in a genuinely important and balanced primary. Rather, the likelihood of a contentious convention looms because of the scheduling of the MI and FL primaries. I wonder how the ticket would appear if MI and FL continue to have their delegates uncredentialed; but I doubt that sanction would be deployed by national party leadership; instead, the most likely is some form of partial image saving as is currently occurring. To me it is a sign of health of the Democratic party when political contentiousness is very public and unpredictable; it is the ungainly character of the party, that it is in touch with the people and slightly undisciplined. I know this is even more discomforting to voters in MI and FL; maybe the dissention within mid level party officials in those states will help reform their apparatus for the next election. I worry much more about who McCain might select for veep, though the Republicans are going to lose in the autumn if the voting machines actually work. If the voting machines freeze, McCain as president would have a few years in which to commission his constitutional convention, as where the Republican party leadership has said it intends to take the public dialog is way beyond what our system of checks and balances could legitimize as currently configured.

By: Rayne

Rayne — Fri, 14 Mar 2008 16:41:35 +0000

I think non-Michiganders simply don’t get the levels of raw anger present here–anger directed at these same super-delegates who, according to this genius “solution,” would pawn off the punishment for the super-delegates own Clusterfuck on ordinary voters.

I will tell you after last night’s local party meeting — 3 hours, mind you, needing a very firm hand to keep it on track — Marcy is actually understated in her representation.

The rank-and-file members are FURIOUS about this mess, utterly outraged at being betrayed. They haven’t yet made the full connection as to who exactly is responsible, but when they do, LOOK OUT.

I ask that folks outside of Michigan (and Florida, too, for that matter) use caution when pasting the label “Democrats” on the parties who steered us into the Clusterfuck-that-is-our-primary.

Who are “Democrats”? Marcy? Me? we’re dues paying members, we’re activists in the local party. We didn’t ask for this mess.

By: Leen

Leen — Fri, 14 Mar 2008 16:38:27 +0000

If Obama is ahead and the superdelegates trump the process and choose Clinton..the “raw anger” that EW referred to will rip any potential unity apart. Guaranteed! How can we forget the Democrats lost in 2000 (to a Supreme Court Judicial coup) and in 2004. If Hillary and Obama do not pivot real soon in a united fashion and harness the new enthusiasm that Obama has stirred up and the experience of Clinton drawing on both of their strengths. 2008 is not a given. If they do not turn the spotlight on McCain and the failed and disastrous policies of this administration during the last seven years this incredible opportunity could be turned into a loss.

By: Leen

Leen — Fri, 14 Mar 2008 16:29:34 +0000

Athens.

By: klynn

klynn — Fri, 14 Mar 2008 16:27:16 +0000

I did a lot of work “on foot” in Columbus. Experienced much of the same. I did notice, as I “dug” into the “hope and change,” individuals were able to speak on issues.

It just confirmed for me, more on the issues please.

May I ask, where in Ohio you are located?

By: BlueStateRedHead

BlueStateRedHead — Fri, 14 Mar 2008 16:18:55 +0000

See my @36 for some insight on Rethug strategy from Rethug circles : if the superdelegates give it Clinton, they’ll call Florida Foul on us.