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	<title>Comments on: August 2007 PDB: Iran Not Determined to Get Nukes</title>
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		<title>By: readerOfTeaLeaves</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34986</link>
		<dc:creator>readerOfTeaLeaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Dec 2007 06:06:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/#comment-34986</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Ishmael, Okay, so far three of us are nuts.&lt;br /&gt;
But I do see a different tone in the press.&lt;br /&gt;
I still think the Brits are far ahead of us — any president should have to defend his/her policies before Congress, not simply before the press.  The parliamentary system would have revealed Bush’s smallness and limitations much earlier, and perhaps things would not have spun this far out of control.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Watching Bush really made me uncomfortable.  Something’s unraveling.  Ick!!!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ishmael, Okay, so far three of us are nuts.<br />
But I do see a different tone in the press.<br />
I still think the Brits are far ahead of us — any president should have to defend his/her policies before Congress, not simply before the press.  The parliamentary system would have revealed Bush’s smallness and limitations much earlier, and perhaps things would not have spun this far out of control.</p>
<p>Watching Bush really made me uncomfortable.  Something’s unraveling.  Ick!!!</p>
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		<title>By: FormerFed</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34837</link>
		<dc:creator>FormerFed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 21:04:56 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;Marcy,&lt;br /&gt;
I think you may be getting a little paranoid here. I agree with burnspbesq @19. The vetting of any proposed conclusion is a vital part of any high risk effort and certainly for matters impacting national policy of this scope.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;My take, and my fervent hope, is that the steadfast professionals in the Intelligence Community have risen to the task and their higher ups have finally found the backbone that they lacked under the Tenet regime.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marcy,<br />
I think you may be getting a little paranoid here. I agree with burnspbesq @19. The vetting of any proposed conclusion is a vital part of any high risk effort and certainly for matters impacting national policy of this scope.</p>
<p>My take, and my fervent hope, is that the steadfast professionals in the Intelligence Community have risen to the task and their higher ups have finally found the backbone that they lacked under the Tenet regime.</p>
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		<title>By: radiofreewill</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34826</link>
		<dc:creator>radiofreewill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 20:23:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/#comment-34826</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The Wilsons were the ‘fact’ that Cheney needed ‘fixed’ to fit the policy of the “State-Sponsors of Terror pursuing Nuclear Weapons Ambitions within the Axis of Evil.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Iraq was only a stepping-stone in BushCo’s Neocon World-Dominance plan, which called for rolling-up the Middle East militarily and taking control of the Oil Resources of Other Sovereign Nations on a ‘pretext’ of Fighting the Global War on Terror.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;To keep the War Wagon rolling on into Iran, Cheney wouldn’t tolerate any ‘exculpatory’ information coming from the IC - Truth-telling wasn’t appreciated if it went Counter to the Policy.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Hence, if Joe determined that Iraq didn’t buy Uranium from Niger, thereby exposing Bush’s primary rationale for Pre-Emptive, Aggressive War was Wrong, and if, in addition, Valerie’s CPD Group also determined that Iran had shut-down its Nuclear Weapons Program in 2003, then one can be certain that Cheney saw the Wilsons as Enemies of the Agenda.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The Wilsons sin was Telling the Truth, contrary to Bush and Cheney’s Lies.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Wilsons were the ‘fact’ that Cheney needed ‘fixed’ to fit the policy of the “State-Sponsors of Terror pursuing Nuclear Weapons Ambitions within the Axis of Evil.”</p>
<p>Iraq was only a stepping-stone in BushCo’s Neocon World-Dominance plan, which called for rolling-up the Middle East militarily and taking control of the Oil Resources of Other Sovereign Nations on a ‘pretext’ of Fighting the Global War on Terror.</p>
<p>To keep the War Wagon rolling on into Iran, Cheney wouldn’t tolerate any ‘exculpatory’ information coming from the IC &#8211; Truth-telling wasn’t appreciated if it went Counter to the Policy.</p>
<p>Hence, if Joe determined that Iraq didn’t buy Uranium from Niger, thereby exposing Bush’s primary rationale for Pre-Emptive, Aggressive War was Wrong, and if, in addition, Valerie’s CPD Group also determined that Iran had shut-down its Nuclear Weapons Program in 2003, then one can be certain that Cheney saw the Wilsons as Enemies of the Agenda.</p>
<p>The Wilsons sin was Telling the Truth, contrary to Bush and Cheney’s Lies.</p>
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		<title>By: Ishmael</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34824</link>
		<dc:creator>Ishmael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 20:22:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/#comment-34824</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Bmaz and ROTL -&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Make it three of us!  The Press Corpse was unusually persistent with W this morning, and I think they sensed the same level of discomfort that we have noted - rather than a docile press gallery which doesn’t want to push issues, I would love to see Bush cross-examined by someone like Pat Fitz who knows what he is doing!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bmaz and ROTL -</p>
<p>Make it three of us!  The Press Corpse was unusually persistent with W this morning, and I think they sensed the same level of discomfort that we have noted &#8211; rather than a docile press gallery which doesn’t want to push issues, I would love to see Bush cross-examined by someone like Pat Fitz who knows what he is doing!</p>
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		<title>By: CanuckStuckinMuck</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34810</link>
		<dc:creator>CanuckStuckinMuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 18:57:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/#comment-34810</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;EW. Nice place you have here…&lt;br /&gt;
On POTUS’s recent dissembling about Iran and nukes. I can only remember one for certain, the one about WWIII. In that comment, GWB was (I’m guessing) careful to say that we couldn’t afford to let Iran&lt;br /&gt;
have the knowledge to make nucular weapons&lt;br /&gt;
. It’s subtle, but if Deadeye is writing the script, not outside the realm of possibility.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>EW. Nice place you have here…<br />
On POTUS’s recent dissembling about Iran and nukes. I can only remember one for certain, the one about WWIII. In that comment, GWB was (I’m guessing) careful to say that we couldn’t afford to let Iran<br />
have the knowledge to make nucular weapons<br />
. It’s subtle, but if Deadeye is writing the script, not outside the realm of possibility.</p>
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		<title>By: readerOfTeaLeaves</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34806</link>
		<dc:creator>readerOfTeaLeaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 18:45:04 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;bmaz, at least two of us are ‘nuts’, then.  Nice to have company 8-0&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But your words ‘vacant’ and ‘automaton’ synch with parts of what I saw. In all honesty, watching without the sound was more informative than having it on.  (Although his speech pattern is so eerily flat that having it on does provide other… ‘information’.  But it’s just so…. profoundly, eerily sad…)  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Ick!!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bmaz, at least two of us are ‘nuts’, then.  Nice to have company 8-0</p>
<p>But your words ‘vacant’ and ‘automaton’ synch with parts of what I saw. In all honesty, watching without the sound was more informative than having it on.  (Although his speech pattern is so eerily flat that having it on does provide other… ‘information’.  But it’s just so…. profoundly, eerily sad…)  </p>
<p>Ick!!</p>
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		<title>By: bmaz</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34798</link>
		<dc:creator>bmaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 18:20:13 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;I have always seen that in Bush in those kind of situations to some extent; but, you are right, it has gotten markedly worse.  I think he has been on a good downward slope since that Jackson Square speech in New Orleans.  Lately, he has been almost vacant; like an automaton mouthing words without any self context, but a lot of inner petulance and anger.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have always seen that in Bush in those kind of situations to some extent; but, you are right, it has gotten markedly worse.  I think he has been on a good downward slope since that Jackson Square speech in New Orleans.  Lately, he has been almost vacant; like an automaton mouthing words without any self context, but a lot of inner petulance and anger.</p>
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		<title>By: klynn</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34797</link>
		<dc:creator>klynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 18:17:23 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;EW, thanks for the heads up.  Still catching up from yesterday.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Here’s another question for P. B.–&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;How does the leader of our country talk tough about military action towards another country for the last year and then state, “I just learned this intell,”?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;If he led our country towards war without calling for deep intelligence analysis, he should be out of a job for questionable decision making. Obviously, the other option is that he has known all along and he has lied to the public. Playing, the “I just found out” card makes him out to be incapable of carrying out his oath of office.  Likewise, the same goes for VP. Congress needs to act on both VP and Prz.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;This all puts a new light on Brit pull-out of Iraq announcements in February and the beginning of the military pull-out before August.  It also puts light on the minor country military support pulling out by August.  Many cannot afford to be linked to another US invasion.  These pull-outs are as much a diplomatic statement to  the US and less for the need of Iraq  independence. At least in regards to this NIE and its’ timing…&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>EW, thanks for the heads up.  Still catching up from yesterday.</p>
<p>Here’s another question for P. B.–</p>
<p>How does the leader of our country talk tough about military action towards another country for the last year and then state, “I just learned this intell,”?</p>
<p>If he led our country towards war without calling for deep intelligence analysis, he should be out of a job for questionable decision making. Obviously, the other option is that he has known all along and he has lied to the public. Playing, the “I just found out” card makes him out to be incapable of carrying out his oath of office.  Likewise, the same goes for VP. Congress needs to act on both VP and Prz.</p>
<p>This all puts a new light on Brit pull-out of Iraq announcements in February and the beginning of the military pull-out before August.  It also puts light on the minor country military support pulling out by August.  Many cannot afford to be linked to another US invasion.  These pull-outs are as much a diplomatic statement to  the US and less for the need of Iraq  independence. At least in regards to this NIE and its’ timing…</p>
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		<title>By: readerOfTeaLeaves</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34795</link>
		<dc:creator>readerOfTeaLeaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 18:06:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/#comment-34795</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Yeah, Ishmael, I had some MSNBC.com video running in another browser window and watched from the corner of my eye. I ran it several times; the first two without sound just to see whether any body language was odd enough to catch my attention.  I haven’t watched Bush for awhile, and I was quite struck at how terrible he looks.  (Watch with the sound off; he looks labored in his body language when he speaks, repeatedly. He also has a staccato quality that  is much more pronounced that I recall from a year or so ago.)  Weirdly, I had an odd thought - mostly from not really watching with attention, but out of one corner of my eye, I thought, “Is that guy well enough to make it through 2008…?” &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Not wanting to spread malice, and maybe I’m seeing amiss, but there’s something about just watching that guy without sound on that is just… out of synch or something.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Then, I replayed parts with the sound on — on that msnbc.com presser, at about 4:30 into it, David Gregory asks a question. You see Bush’s mouth twist in aggravation as Gregory finishes the question.  (What’s that about?  Last that I remember Gregory, he was  ‘rappin’ with MC Rove.’  So why does Bush so dislike Gregory?)  Then Gregory asks a (rather pointed) question, and Bush literally turns his body away from Gregory before he turns back to the podium to answer the question.  How bizarre is that…?!  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;God, I adore digital video.  But that’s OT.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Bush’s words and actions seldom align.  Reading the body language, it looks almost as if Bush is in deep defense/denial mode; I wouldn’t put much stock in what he actually says.  But he sure wasn’t making much sincere eye contact, which raises questions about how deeply he actually believes whatever words he used.  His body language is… just somehow not right.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Am I nuts?&lt;br /&gt;
Anyone else see this weirdness…?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, Ishmael, I had some MSNBC.com video running in another browser window and watched from the corner of my eye. I ran it several times; the first two without sound just to see whether any body language was odd enough to catch my attention.  I haven’t watched Bush for awhile, and I was quite struck at how terrible he looks.  (Watch with the sound off; he looks labored in his body language when he speaks, repeatedly. He also has a staccato quality that  is much more pronounced that I recall from a year or so ago.)  Weirdly, I had an odd thought &#8211; mostly from not really watching with attention, but out of one corner of my eye, I thought, “Is that guy well enough to make it through 2008…?” </p>
<p>Not wanting to spread malice, and maybe I’m seeing amiss, but there’s something about just watching that guy without sound on that is just… out of synch or something.</p>
<p>Then, I replayed parts with the sound on — on that msnbc.com presser, at about 4:30 into it, David Gregory asks a question. You see Bush’s mouth twist in aggravation as Gregory finishes the question.  (What’s that about?  Last that I remember Gregory, he was  ‘rappin’ with MC Rove.’  So why does Bush so dislike Gregory?)  Then Gregory asks a (rather pointed) question, and Bush literally turns his body away from Gregory before he turns back to the podium to answer the question.  How bizarre is that…?!  </p>
<p>God, I adore digital video.  But that’s OT.</p>
<p>Bush’s words and actions seldom align.  Reading the body language, it looks almost as if Bush is in deep defense/denial mode; I wouldn’t put much stock in what he actually says.  But he sure wasn’t making much sincere eye contact, which raises questions about how deeply he actually believes whatever words he used.  His body language is… just somehow not right.  </p>
<p>Am I nuts?<br />
Anyone else see this weirdness…?</p>
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		<title>By: emptywheel</title>
		<link>http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/comment-page-1/#comment-34790</link>
		<dc:creator>emptywheel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 17:50:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/04/august-2007-pdb-iran-not-determined-to-get-nukes/#comment-34790</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Got one started over &lt;a href=&quot;http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/03/intelligence-puts-a-crimp-in-dicks-war-mongering/&quot;&gt;in this post&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Got one started over <a href="http://emptywheel.firedoglake.com/2007/12/03/intelligence-puts-a-crimp-in-dicks-war-mongering/">in this post</a>.</p>
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